Hybridisation Q: Does Oxygen Hybridize for CO2?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the hybridization of oxygen in the context of carbon dioxide (CO2) and water (H2O). Participants explore the conditions under which hybridization occurs, the role of energetic splitting between orbitals, and the implications for molecular geometry.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that hybridization primarily concerns the central atom, questioning whether oxygen hybridizes when forming bonds in CO2.
  • Others argue that the energetic splitting between s and p orbitals in oxygen is much larger than in carbon, making hybridization inefficient, with oxygen's valence orbitals remaining as p orbitals.
  • A participant seeks clarification on the term "doubly occupied" in relation to oxygen's s orbitals.
  • One participant points out that hybridization is not necessary to explain bonding in H2O, as each hydrogen can bond using a p orbital.
  • Another participant contends that hybridization helps explain the bent shape of H2O, despite the energy gap in oxygen being similar to that in CO2.
  • Some participants discuss the angle between bonding orbitals in H2O, noting that it is supported by calculations, while questioning the applicability of hybridization to sulfur in H2S.
  • A later reply suggests that the basis for hybridization in sulfur is weak, citing differences in orbital sizes and bond angles, and expresses skepticism about the reliance on qualitative models in textbooks.
  • One participant advises against invoking d-orbitals in explaining bonding in main group elements and emphasizes the importance of using normal s and p orbitals where applicable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the necessity and effectiveness of hybridization in explaining bonding in CO2 and H2O, with no consensus reached on the role of hybridization in these contexts.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in qualitative models and the challenges of predicting bond angles accurately. There is also mention of the historical context of hybridization theories and their application in educational materials.

gracy
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please answer.QUESTION ABOUT HYBRIDISATION. - during determining hybridisation we look only for central atom ,other atoms with which central atom combines ,say for eg ,in CO2 we take c as central atom and take its hybridization but does oxygen also hybridized before forming sigma bonds?
 
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In oxygen, the energetic splitting between the s and the p orbitals is much larger than in C, so hybridization is inefficient. The valence orbitals on O will be p orbitals while the s orbitals will stay doubly occupied and not participate in bonding.
 
DrDu said:
In oxygen, the energetic splitting between the s and the p orbitals is much larger than in C, so hybridization is inefficient. The valence orbitals on O will be p orbitals while the s orbitals will stay doubly occupied and not participate in bonding.
what do you mean by doubly occupied ?
 
two electrons
 
DrDu said:
In oxygen, the energetic splitting between the s and the p orbitals is much larger than in C, so hybridization is inefficient. The valence orbitals on O will be p orbitals while the s orbitals will stay doubly occupied and not participate in bonding.
ok you are saying as hybridization to occur energy difference between orbitals should not be large as in oxygen but if we consider H2O (water molecule) in this central atom is oxygen ,so there will be hybridization of oxygen but energy gap will be still same as in oxygen of CO2 .so why hybridization of oxygen is possible in H2O but not in CO2?
 
You don't need hybridization to explain the bonding in H2O. Each hydrogen can make a bond with one p orbital.
 
DrDu said:
You don't need hybridization to explain the bonding in H2O. Each hydrogen can make a bond with one p orbital.
but hybridisation explains shape of H2O which is bent.
 
There is also an angle between two p orbitals. Ok, it is a little bit smaller than the bond angle, but this angle between the bonding orbitals on O is supported by actual calculations.
 
DrDu said:
There is also an angle between two p orbitals. Ok, it is a little bit smaller than the bond angle, but this angle between the bonding orbitals on O is supported by actual calculations.
so you mean in H2S also hybridization of sulpher is not there ?then why my textbook explains all these on the basis of hybridization.
/
 
  • #10
With sulphur, the basis for hybridization is even thinner. The bond angle is smaller and the s and p orbitals are of quite different size, so that hybridization won't be effective.

I don't know why textbooks perpetuate stuff which has been proven wrong for more than 50 years. I suppose because chemistry teachers usually have only a faint idea of theoretical chemistry.
Specifically the principle of maximal orbital overlap introduced by Pauling is fishy.

My advice is the following:

1. Don't expect too much from qualitative models. Predicting a bond angle precisely is very difficult.

2. Valence bond theory tries to explain the electronic structure of molecules using free atoms as a starting point. So use the normal s and p orbitals where possible.

3. In some cases, specifically carbon compounds, you have to start from an excited carbon atom with the s and the 3 p orbitals occupied with one electron each. This is called "promotion".
If you don't do this, you will have difficulties to explain why there are 4 bonds instead of only two.
Then also hybrid orbitals can be used.

4. Never invoke d-orbitals (or spd hybrids) to explain bonding in main group elements.
 

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