In Euclidian space, closed ball is equal to closure of open ball

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving that in Euclidean space, the closure of an open ball is equal to the closed ball. Participants explore various approaches to demonstrate this relationship within the context of metric spaces, specifically focusing on sequences and properties of convergence.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents an initial proof attempt using sequences to show that the closure of the open ball is contained within the closed ball.
  • Another participant suggests a simpler approach by constructing a sequence that converges to a boundary point of the closed ball, arguing that this sequence remains within the open ball.
  • A third participant acknowledges a mistake in their proof regarding the arbitrary radius and attempts to refine their argument based on the previous suggestion.
  • Discussion includes the introduction of a general theorem about convex functions and their relationship to the problem, though some participants express unfamiliarity with these concepts.
  • Several participants engage in clarifying the definition of convex functions and their implications for the proof.
  • One participant expresses uncertainty about how to relate a point in the open ball to the convex function in order to complete their proof.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the validity of the proof methods discussed, but there remains uncertainty regarding the completion of the proof, particularly in the "supseteq" direction. Multiple approaches are proposed, indicating that the discussion is not fully resolved.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note limitations in their understanding of convex functions and normed vector spaces, which may affect their ability to fully engage with the proposed methods.

CGandC
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Problem: Let ## (X,d) ## be a metric space, denote as ## B(c,r) = \{ x \in X : d(c,x) < r \} ## the open ball at radius ## r>0 ## around ## c \in X ##, denote as ## \bar{B}(c, r) = \{ x \in X : d(c,x) \leq r \} ## the closed ball and for all ## A \subset X ## we'll denote as ## cl(A) ## the closure of ## A ## ( sometimes denoted also as ## \bar{A} ## ).

Show that in ## \mathbb{R}^n ## with the standard metric it occurs that: ## cl(B(c, r))=\bar{B}(c, r) ##

Attempt:
## ( \subseteq ) ## Let ## \tau \in cl(B(c,r)) ##. There exists a sequence ## x_n \in B(c,r) ## s.t. ## x_n \rightarrow \tau ##
( From a theorem that says: ## x \in cl(B) \iff ## there exists a sequence ## x_n \in B ## , ## x_n \rightarrow x ## ).
Note that for all ## n \in \mathbb{N} ##, from the fact ## x_n \in B(c,r) ## we have ## d(c,x_n) < r ##. Also, since ## x_n \rightarrow \tau ## we have that ## d(x_n,\tau) \rightarrow 0 ##.
So by triangle inequality, we have for all ## n \in \mathbb{N} ## that ## d(c,x) \leq d(c,x_n) + d(x,x_n) ##, taking the limit we get ## d(c,x) \leq r ##.

## ( \supseteq ) ## Let ## \tau \in \bar{B}(c,r) ##, hence ## d(c,\tau) \leq r ##.
( Now we want to show that ## \tau \in cl(B(c,r)) ##, meaning for all ## r>0 ## we want to show ## B(\tau,r) \cap B(c,r) \neq \emptyset ## )
Let ## r>0 ##. Notice that ## \tau \in B(\tau,r) ## since ## d(\tau,\tau) =0 < r ##. In addition we have ## \tau \in \bar{B}(c,r) ## then ## d(\tau,c) \leq r ##.
If ## d(\tau,c)<r ## then ## \tau \in B(c,r) ##,
hence ## \tau \in B(\tau,r) \cap B(c,r) ##.
If ## d(\tau,c) = r ## then [ missing arguments for completing proof ].How to prove the "## ( \supseteq ) ##" side? I thought maybe I'd use the theorem "## x \in cl(B) \iff ## there exists a sequence ## x_n \in B ## , ## x_n \rightarrow x ## "; that means I'd show the existence of a sequence ## (x_k)_{k=1} \subseteq R^n ## s.t. ## (x_k)_{k=1} = ((x^{(1)}_i)_{i=1}^n,(x^{(2)}_i)_{i=1}^n,... ) ## s.t. ## x_k = (x^{(k)}_i)_{i=1}^n ## s.t. ## (x^{(k)}_i)_{i=1}^n \in R^n ## , but the question is how to define this sequence of sequences?
 
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You don't need a sequence of sequences.
For a point ##x## on the boundary of the closed ball, why not just approach it by the sequence that goes along the line segment from ##c## to ##x##, starting at ##c## and at each step jumping to halfway between current location and ##x##. You should be able to prove that converges to ##x## and that all its points are in the open ball.
 
Ok, here's what I've did:
I started drawing an intuitive ( non-precise ) picture of what you've said,
1644591793832.png


I've noted that In the attempted proof I gave I had mistaken with the arbitrary ## r ## I introduced with the ## r ## given in the question. Here's my attempted proof based on your idea:


Let ## \tau \in cl(B(c,r)) ## be arbitrary. Hence ##d(c,\tau) \leq r##.
Take the sequence ## (x_m) \subseteq \mathbb{R}^n ## defined as follows,
For every ## m \in \mathbb{N} ##, ## x_m = c + \sum_{k=1}^{m}\frac{\tau-c}{2^i} = c + \frac{1}{2}\cdot(\tau-c)\sum_{k=0}^{m-1} \frac{1}{2^k} = c + ( \tau - c)\cdot(1-(\frac{1}{2})^m) ##
Note that ## \lim_{m\to\infty}x_m = \tau ##.
Also note that ## x_m ## is a vector equation, meaning that for all ## 1 \leq i \leq n ## , ## (x_m)_i = c_i + ( \tau_i - c_i)\cdot(1-(\frac{1}{2})^m) ##, from this, note that ## (x_m) \subseteq B(c,r) ## since for all ## m \in \mathbb{N} ## we have that ## d(c,x_m) = \sqrt{ \Bigg( c_1 - \bigg( c_1 + ( \tau_1 - c_1)\cdot(1-(\frac{1}{2})^m) \bigg) \Bigg)^2 + \cdots + \Bigg( c_n - \bigg( c_n + ( \tau_n - c_n)\cdot(1-(\frac{1}{2})^m) \bigg) \Bigg)^2 } =
( 1 - (\frac{1}{2})^m ) \sqrt{ ( \tau_1 - c_1)^2 + \cdots + ( \tau_n - c_n)^2 }.## Since ## d(c,\tau) \leq r ## we can see that ## d(c,x_m) < r ##, hence ## (x_m) \subseteq B(c,r) ##. So since ## \lim_{m\to\infty}x_m = \tau ## and ## \tau ## was arbitrary, we're finished.Do you think this is ok?
 

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Sometimes a general fact is much easier to prove because the key points are presented explicitly.

Let ##f:X\to \mathbb{R}## be a convex continuous function on the normed vector space ##X##. Then
$$\mathrm{cl}\,\{x\in X\mid f(x)<c\}=\{x\in X\mid f(x)\le c\}$$
 
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Thanks but I haven't learned about convex functions and normed vector spaces yet (I'm doing a real analysis course and just very little of the basics of topology are taught). It seems to me that If I can create such a function as you've said, the proof will be finished.
 
Convex function is a function such that the inequality
$$f(\lambda x_1+(1-\lambda)x_2)\le \lambda f(x_1)+(1-\lambda)f(x_2)$$
holds for all $$x_1,x_2\in X,\quad \lambda\in[0,1].$$
Take ##f(x)=\|\tilde x-x\|## and ##X=\mathbb{R}^m##
 
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wrobel said:
Convex function is a function such that the inequality
$$f(\lambda x_1+(1-\lambda)x_2)\le \lambda f(x_1)+(1-\lambda)f(x_2)$$
holds for all $$x_1,x_2\in X,\quad \lambda\in[0,1].$$
Take ##f(x)=\|\tilde x-x\|## and ##X=\mathbb{R}^m##

Ok now I understand how the general theorem you proposed relates to the problem. In the private case you proposed I get what I'm asked to prove. How do I prove the "## \supseteq ##" direction? got a hint please?

Here's what I've done ( had no clue how to proceed beyond the beginning ):
Let ## x ## be arbitrary such that ## f(x) \leq c ##. Let ## r>0 ##. We'll show that ## B(x,r) \subseteq \{ y \in X : f(y) < c \} ##. Let ## \tau \in B(x,r) ##, thus ## d(x,\tau)<r ##. [ I don't see how can I relate ## \tau ## to ## f ## in order to have ## f(\tau) < c ##. ]

I then thought maybe I'd find a sequence ## x_n \in \{ y \in X : f(y) < c \} ## which converges to ## x ## and that'd show ## x ## is in ## \mathrm{cl}\,\{x\in X\mid f(x)<c\} ## , but couldn't think of anything that'd help me allow to do that.

andrewkirk said:
@CGandC Yes your proof works.
Thanks for the help!
 

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