Irreducible representation of S3

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the irreducible representations of the symmetric group S3, particularly focusing on the invariant subspaces associated with these representations. Participants explore concepts related to matrix representations, invariant subspaces, and orthogonality in the context of linear algebra and group theory.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the identification of invariant subspaces in the context of S3 representations, specifically questioning the reasoning behind the numbers associated with these subspaces.
  • Another participant provides a specific matrix representation of S3 and asks how it can be expressed with respect to a different basis, indicating a need for clarity on basis transformations.
  • A third participant suggests that the method for expressing matrices in different bases is typically covered in linear algebra courses, hinting at the use of similarity transformations.
  • A later reply emphasizes that if a matrix preserves angles, the orthogonal complement of an invariant subspace must also be invariant under the action of the matrix, which ties back to the discussion on invariant subspaces.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not appear to reach a consensus on the specific numbers or methods for identifying invariant subspaces, and there is ongoing confusion and exploration of the topic.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes references to specific pages in a book, indicating that the understanding of the topic may depend on the definitions and examples provided therein. There is an acknowledgment of the complexity involved in the transformation of matrices and the concept of orthogonality in relation to invariant subspaces.

sineontheline
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okay so i was reading a book on representations and found this discussion and was confused:
http://books.google.com/books?id=Hm...eory and physics&pg=PA53#v=onepage&q=&f=false
it starts at the bottom of pg 53 and ends at the top of pg 54

so I understood the beginning of the discussion:
there are matrix representations of S3 and they permute the vector components
but (1,1,1) constitutes an invariant subspace cause what ever you permutation occurs on that, will bring you back to (1,1,1)

but then it goes on to say:
"To find another invariant subspace, we note that every 3 X 3 matric in the representation belongs to O(3) and hence preserves the ordinary Euclidean scalar product. Therefore, the subspace W' orthogonal to (1,1,1) is also invariant."
It then goes on to list the invariant subspace.

I got lost. Can anyone help? Why did they come up with those numbers? (and how too)

The example is particularly important cause he uses it later:
http://books.google.com/books?id=Hm...eory and physics&pg=PA96#v=onepage&q=&f=false
 
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The matrix

<br /> <br /> \left[<br /> \begin{array}{ccc}<br /> 0 &amp; 0 &amp; 1\\<br /> 1 &amp; 0 &amp; 0\\<br /> 0 &amp; 1 &amp; 0<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right]<br /> <br />

is with respect to the standard basis

<br /> <br /> \left\{ \left(<br /> \begin{array}{c}<br /> 1\\<br /> 0\\<br /> 0<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right),<br /> \left(<br /> \begin{array}{c}<br /> 0\\<br /> 1\\<br /> 0<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right),<br /> <br /> \left(<br /> \begin{array}{c}<br /> 0\\<br /> 0\\<br /> 1<br /> \end{array}<br /> \right) \right\}.<br />

How is this expressed with respect to the basis \left\{\mathbf{e}_1, \mathbf{e}_2, \mathbf{e}_3 \right\}?
 
George Jones said:
How is this expressed with respect to the basis \left\{\mathbf{e}_1, \mathbf{e}_2, \mathbf{e}_3 \right\}?

How to do this typically is covered at the end of a first course in linear algebra or at the beginning of a second course. Perform a similarity transform using the change of basis matrix.
 
sineontheline said:
okay so i was reading a book on representations and found this discussion and was confused:
http://books.google.com/books?id=Hm...eory and physics&pg=PA53#v=onepage&q=&f=false
it starts at the bottom of pg 53 and ends at the top of pg 54

so I understood the beginning of the discussion:
there are matrix representations of S3 and they permute the vector components
but (1,1,1) constitutes an invariant subspace cause what ever you permutation occurs on that, will bring you back to (1,1,1)

but then it goes on to say:
"To find another invariant subspace, we note that every 3 X 3 matric in the representation belongs to O(3) and hence preserves the ordinary Euclidean scalar product. Therefore, the subspace W' orthogonal to (1,1,1) is also invariant."
It then goes on to list the invariant subspace.

I got lost. Can anyone help? Why did they come up with those numbers? (and how too)

The example is particularly important cause he uses it later:
http://books.google.com/books?id=Hm...eory and physics&pg=PA96#v=onepage&q=&f=false

If a matrix preserves angles then the orthogonal complement of an invariant subspace must also be invariant because it remains orthogonal to the first invariant subspace under the action of the matrix.
 

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