Is a computer science degree suitable for someone with no programming exp

[Adam.]

Howdy All!

I have been lurking in the shadows of physicsforums for a few months now, but this is my first official post here.

A bit of background about me. I'm technically in my second year of university, but I say "technically" because I more or less squandered away my first year. I'm really lost, and have thought long and hard about what I want to study and what career I want, but I really can't think of anything. I'm sort of a scatter-brain, who can be interested in physics one week, history the next week, and then just want to be a worthless bum playing video games the week after. Truthfully, I can't see myself in any job I like. I like philosophy a lot, and will probably minor in it instead of majoring, because I don't want to be perpetually unemployed, or accepting some random "liberal arts degree" job upon graduation.

I was thinking of majoring in computer science. I love logic, and puzzle solving, but am not too sure about the more "practical" side of computer science. I shouldn't say I dislike programming because I have no programming experience, it's just that I wouldn't be like these kids who have been programming since they were 6 years old, and I am worried that this would put me at a disadvantage. On the other hand, I absolutely love logic and math-related puzzles and am VERY interested in the abstract side of computer science (logic, computability theory, Turing machines, Godel's theorems...(though admittedly, I don't know very much about them yet)). So, do I stand a chance of enjoying and being good at a computer science major?

Can I be a philosophically oriented comp sci guy?

 

[fss]

You are at least going to have to become mildly proficient in a programming language (probably Java and C) as a requirement for any undergraduate CS degree. Once you get past the first 2 years the more "practical" classes should be out of the way.

 

[Math Is Hard]

Why not take an introductory or "survey" course in computer science and see if it floats your boat?

 

[Adam.]

Why not take an introductory or "survey" course in computer science and see if it floats your boat?

That's probably what I'll end up doing. It's just that I've been wasting a lot of time lately, and was trying to find something I could commit myself to, or at least, rule out "a priori". As of now, I'm headed straight for "worthless bum-ville"...

 

[Kevin_Axion]

You can look at these lectures which are aimed at people with little or no programming experience: .

 

[The_Duck]

You are at least going to have to become mildly proficient in a programming language (probably Java and C) as a requirement for any undergraduate CS degree. Once you get past the first 2 years the more "practical" classes should be out of the way.

By "practical" you mean "programming"? As a CS major finished with my graduation requirements, I think I've taken only one CS class (algorithms) that didn't involve substantial programming projects.

I think it is not a problem to start a CS major with no programming experience. There are introductory courses to teach you. But make sure that when you take one you find programming at least a little enjoyable, otherwise you will be very sad. You can focus on the theoretical stuff, but you will still have to take lots of other classes in which you will write programs.

 

[fasterthanjoao]

There are introductory courses to teach you. But make sure that when you take one you find programming at least a little enjoyable, otherwise you will be very sad.

This line is what you really want to pay attention to. If you take a class and like it, then great. Remember you can also find plenty of programming resources on the internet to mess around with things at home if you have the time. Have a scan of the curriculum of the course you're thinking about attending if you can, and maybe take a quick look at some of the languages that are covered.

 

[discrete*]

Howdy All!

I have been lurking in the shadows of physicsforums for a few months now, but this is my first official post here.

A bit of background about me. I'm technically in my second year of university, but I say "technically" because I more or less squandered away my first year. I'm really lost, and have thought long and hard about what I want to study and what career I want, but I really can't think of anything. I'm sort of a scatter-brain, who can be interested in physics one week, history the next week, and then just want to be a worthless bum playing video games the week after. Truthfully, I can't see myself in any job I like. I like philosophy a lot, and will probably minor in it instead of majoring, because I don't want to be perpetually unemployed, or accepting some random "liberal arts degree" job upon graduation.

I was thinking of majoring in computer science. I love logic, and puzzle solving, but am not too sure about the more "practical" side of computer science. I shouldn't say I dislike programming because I have no programming experience, it's just that I wouldn't be like these kids who have been programming since they were 6 years old, and I am worried that this would put me at a disadvantage. On the other hand, I absolutely love logic and math-related puzzles and am VERY interested in the abstract side of computer science (logic, computability theory, Turing machines, Godel's theorems...(though admittedly, I don't know very much about them yet)). So, do I stand a chance of enjoying and being good at a computer science major?

Can I be a philosophically oriented comp sci guy?

It sounds like you'd be interested in mathematics. Now, at the undergraduate level you'll need to grind through classes like advanced calculus, linear algebra, mathematical logic (which, according to your post, you might like), differential equations, etc, just like the rest of us. But if you're interested in logic and theoretical computer science you can work on those subjects at the graduate level.

Now, if mathematics is a no go for you, than you do as everyone else said and try a comp sci course -- who know, you might like programming.

 

[brownin]

I don’t think you essentially need programming experience for a computer science degree. I am sure it will help, but I doubt it’s absolutely necessary. What you will need are exceptional mathematical, analytically, logical and problem solving skills as a CS degree focuses on the theory behind computing rather than specific technologies. That being said, you will have to complete courses in programming as part of any http://www.cc-sd.edu/computer-science-degree.html"" .

Another thing I’d like to point out is that a CS degree is tough and includes courses on complex subjects. If you have a problem sustaining your interest in one thing for too long, the chances of you dropping out may get compounded considering the tough coursework. Evaluate the seriousness of your intent before you jump into a CS degree.

 

[chiro]

Howdy All!

I have been lurking in the shadows of physicsforums for a few months now, but this is my first official post here.

A bit of background about me. I'm technically in my second year of university, but I say "technically" because I more or less squandered away my first year. I'm really lost, and have thought long and hard about what I want to study and what career I want, but I really can't think of anything. I'm sort of a scatter-brain, who can be interested in physics one week, history the next week, and then just want to be a worthless bum playing video games the week after. Truthfully, I can't see myself in any job I like. I like philosophy a lot, and will probably minor in it instead of majoring, because I don't want to be perpetually unemployed, or accepting some random "liberal arts degree" job upon graduation.

I was thinking of majoring in computer science. I love logic, and puzzle solving, but am not too sure about the more "practical" side of computer science. I shouldn't say I dislike programming because I have no programming experience, it's just that I wouldn't be like these kids who have been programming since they were 6 years old, and I am worried that this would put me at a disadvantage. On the other hand, I absolutely love logic and math-related puzzles and am VERY interested in the abstract side of computer science (logic, computability theory, Turing machines, Godel's theorems...(though admittedly, I don't know very much about them yet)). So, do I stand a chance of enjoying and being good at a computer science major?

Can I be a philosophically oriented comp sci guy?

Hey Adam and welcome to the forums.

First of all computer science is like every other science: it involves solving problems.

Programming is no different: you will have to solve problems a lot and some of them will be problems that you can't "google" for an answer.

If you like programming enough that you can put up with the failures that come with learning something like programming and science (let me tell you there can be a lot of them) then that's a signal that you've picked something good.

When you start off you will most likely be writing code, sometimes it will crash, sometimes it won't do anything remotely what you wanted it to do, and sometimes when it crashes you'll be going through line after line of code trying to find where in the hell it went wrong (good luck if you're debugging some really complex recursive procedure with a stack trace 100's of function calls deep!)

But like anything that requires a bit of dedication it can be very very rewarding. You might write a few demos and when everything 'clicks' its a great feeling.

 

[bcrowell]

If you're at a good school, then a CS degree will be heavily slanted toward the theoretical subjects you say you're interested in. A CS degree is not a vocational certificate in computer programming -- unless your school is a diploma mill. Programming is a difficult craft, and master programmers are as rare as masters at novel writing or architecture. But if theoretical CS is what floats your boat, you can get a CS degree without becoming a master programmer. Conversely, many master programmers are high school dropouts.

 

[Fizex]

If you want to know if computer science is good for you, pick up a d***ed programming book and see! This analogous to exactly what ZapperZ is talking about when people ask if they can go to physics grad school with XYZ degree. When you have no programming experience, jump into a CS degree, and then decide you hate programming blame yourself for not taking the first step.

 

[hadsed]

I think what you want to do, if your school has a good mathematics department, is to go with a math degree and specialize in your upper level classes in discrete mathematics and take classes in logic, combinatorics, graph theory, number theory, set theory, etc. What you're interested in is more with the mathematics of computer science than programming really, and computer science really is sort of like a division of math anyway. The only problem is that, unfortunately, lots of schools don't distinguish between software engineer and computer scientist. Like bcrowell said, you don't need to be a master programmer to be a good scientist/mathematician, but you do need to have some competence and high interest (which you obviously have).

 

[Sway]

As has been said above, the best way to find out if CS is for you is to take the first step and get some experience. Anyone trying to make the decision for you would be doing you an injustice. Outside of QoL preferences; the field is rapidly growing and a great choice from the practical standpoint. The salaries are good, but even more importantly there are many unfilled positions in the job market.

Don't worry about the scatter-brain issue. I had that as well while an undergrad - it passes (sort of). See if these help:

The average salaries you might expect: http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Degree=Bachelor_of_Science_%28BS%2FBSc%2FSB%29,_Computer_Science_%28CS%29/Salary

The kind jobs you can get and a listing of online programs: http://www.onlinecomputersciencedegree.com/computer-science-job-description/

Good Luck

 

[mal4mac]

I know of two philosophy graduates who are now heads of computer science departments! As you *really* like philosophy then why not major in that? You can minor in CS, and if you like it you can maybe go on to do CS type philosophy things (AI, logic programming, HCI, neural networks, cognitive science ...) Try reading Godel, Escher, Bach by Hofstadter...

 

[hadsed]

I don't agree with the guy above because that's anecdotal advice, and I'm pretty sure most employers don't see as much value in philosophy degrees as the two guys the above poster described. Mathematics and computer science is logic-based, like philosophy, and very employable. Reading philosophy books is something you can do on your own time, I don't think you need a degree in philosophy to be a 'philosopher' (whatever that means nowadays, besides academia).

 

[Sway]

The type of undergrad degree you get is important initially and I'm guessing that either the two philo majors spent a lot more time than needed messing around in comp science before actually raising to that level, or got a lucky break (personally knowing someone in the field etc).

Eventually the type of degree you get becomes somewhat null and void, but I don't think there's much question that it matters out the gates.

 

[jtbell]

I know of two philosophy graduates who are now heads of computer science departments!

But when did they get their philosophy degrees, and when did they originally get hired for their computer science faculty positions? Up until around maybe 1985-1990, it was fairly common for people to move "sideways" into academic computer science from other fields, especially math, because there weren't very many people yet with computer science degrees.