Is b a linear combination of a1, a2, and a3?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around determining whether the vector \( b \) can be expressed as a linear combination of the vectors \( a_1, a_2, \) and \( a_3 \). Participants explore concepts related to linear independence, matrix representation, and row reduction techniques in the context of linear algebra.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the problem is straightforward but acknowledges the potential for errors in matrix problems.
  • Another participant points out that the vectors will be independent if the only solution to a specific equation involving coefficients \( A, B, C, \) and \( D \) is the trivial solution \( A = B = C = D = 0 \).
  • A participant mentions that four vectors in three-dimensional space cannot be independent, implying a limitation in the dimensionality of the vectors involved.
  • There is a discussion about the concept of a matrix being "one to one," with one participant expressing uncertainty about its meaning in this context.
  • Another participant clarifies that row reduction can be applied to any matrix and is not limited to augmented matrices, emphasizing that the question is about the uniqueness of the row reduced form.
  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the relationship between "one to one" and the context of matrices, while another clarifies that "one to one" refers to the relationship between independent and dependent variables.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit disagreement regarding the interpretation of "one to one" in relation to matrices and the application of row reduction. There is no consensus on the statements about row equivalence and the uniqueness of row reduced forms.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the definitions and applications of concepts such as "one to one" and row reduction, indicating potential limitations in their understanding of linear algebra principles.

karush
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$\tiny{311.1.3.12}$
Determine if $b$ is a linear combination of $a_1,a_2$ and $a_3$
$ a_1\left[\begin{array}{r} 1\\0\\1 \end{array}\right],
a_2\left[\begin{array}{r} -2\\3\\-2 \end{array}\right],
a_3\left[\begin{array}{r} -6\\7\\5 \end{array}\right],
b=\left[\begin{array}{r} -7\\13\\4 \end{array}\right]$

ok I don't think this is too difficult to do.
but these matrix problems are very error prone
so thot I would just do a step at a time here
from the example I looked at this is the same thing as
$\left[\begin{array}{lll}a_1&+(-2a_2)&+(-6a_3)\\
&+3a_2 &+7a_3\\
a_1&+(-2a_2)&+5a_3) \end{array}\right]
=\left[\begin{array}{r} -7\\13\\4 \end{array}\right]$
I left all the + signs in since I think this is what a combination is, so then
$\left[\begin{array}{rrr|r}1&-2&-6&-7\\
0&3&7&13\\
1&-2&5&4 \end{array}\right]$
by RREF I got $a_1=3,\quad a_2=2\quad a_3=1$
 
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Looks good to me. (up)

-Dan
 
I don't see any matrix!

These vectors will be independent if and only if whenever
[math]A\begin{bmatrix}1 \\ 0 \\ 1\end{bmatrix}+ B\begin{bmatrix}-2 \\ 3 \\ -2\end{bmatrix}+ C\begin{bmatrix}-6 \\ 7 \\ 5\end{bmatrix}+ D\begin{bmatrix}-7 \\ 13 \\ 4 \end{bmatrix}= 0[/math] we must have A= B= C= D= 0.

[math]\begin{bmatrix}A- 2B- 6C- 7D \\ 3B+ 7C+ 13D \\ A- 2B+ 5C+ 4D\end{bmatrix}= \begin{bmatrix}0 \\ 0 \\ 0 \end{bmatrix}[/math].

So we need to solve A- 2B- 6C- 7D= 0., 3B+ 7C+ 13D= 0, and A- 2B+ 5C+ 4D= 0.
If A= B= C= D= 0 is the only solution the vectors are independent. If there are other solutions they are dependent.

Of course, if we were really clever we would have said, right at the start, that four vectors in three dimensional space CAN'T be independent!

No nasty matrices!
 
well that's good to know😎
 
wanted to add this true or false statement and justification:

Each matrix is row equivalent to one to one and only one reduced echelon matrix
ok I don't think this is true because some matrix are not one to one

The row reduction algorithm applies only to augmented matrices for a linear system
no really sure isn't an augmented matrix Ax=b in one place
 
I have no idea what you mean by a matrix being "one to one".

In any case, this question has nothing to do with "one to one". Also row reduction can be applied to any matrix. The matrix doesn't have to be "augmented" and row reduction is not only used to solve equations.

This question is only asking if a row reduction is "unique"- if a given matrix has only one row reduced form..
 
I thot one to one meant like 3 variables 3rows 3cols in Ax=b
 
No, "one to one" means that each value of the independent variable gives one unique value of the dependent value. It does NOT necessarily have anything to do with matrices or linear transformations.
 

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