Is Information a conserved quantity or not?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the nature of information as a conserved quantity within the context of classical and quantum physics. Participants explore the implications of statespace, particularly in relation to smooth manifolds and the concept of infinite states in both classical and quantum treatments. The conversation touches on theoretical frameworks, including entanglement and quantum gravity, and questions the measurability and definition of information.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the assumption of infinite states in classical and quantum physics implies that information is also infinite, and whether this suggests it is a conserved quantity.
  • Another participant summarizes the question regarding whether a variable with a countable infinite set of measured values can still be a conserved quantity.
  • A third participant asserts that the answer to the summary question is "Yes," providing examples such as angular momentum, electric charge, hadron number, and lepton number as proofs of conservation.
  • A later reply challenges the meaningfulness of the summary question, suggesting it lacks clarity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the summary question, with some supporting the idea of conservation in the context of infinite sets, while others find the question itself to be meaningless. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of information as a conserved quantity.

Contextual Notes

There is a lack of consensus on the definition of information and its relationship to conservation laws. The discussion also highlights potential ambiguities in the phrasing of the summary question.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in the intersections of information theory, quantum mechanics, and conservation laws may find the discussion relevant.

Pythagorean
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TL;DR
Could a variable who's measured values are a countable infinite set still be a conserved quantity?
I've been wondering about statespace. Classically, we assume statespace is infinite (presumably so that we can depend on smooth, differentiable manifolds). But even in quantum, we assume a smooth space and time on which we define wave functions and operations (at least in undergrad quantum, that was the treatment).

I've been watching Susskin's lectures on Quantum Gravity (don't groan yet) and thinking about the entanglement-wormhole thought experiment and wondering about space topologically. Would these topological treatments around quantum/gravity unification not also suggest infinite states?

If you accept that availability of states is infinite in both classical and quantum treatment, then, by extension is information infinite (I couldn't find a single definition of information)?
And does that imply whether it's a conserved quantity or not?
Can we measure whether information is a conserved quantity or is statespace space more axiomatic in physics than empirical?
 
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Pythagorean said:
Summary: Could a variable who's measured values are a countable infinite set still be a conserved quantity?

I've been watching Susskin's lectures on Quantum Gravity
Your question is discussed well in lecture 1 of Susskind's Statistical Mechanics course.
 
Short answer to Summary Question: Yes.
Proof by examples: Angular momentum, Electric Charge, Hadron number, Lepton number.
 
Thread closed.
The stated summary -- "Could a variable who's measured values are a countable infinite set still be a conserved quantity?" -- seems to me to be meaningless at best.
 

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