Is it possible to see the stars in the sky?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether it is possible to see the stars in the sky, with a particular focus on the nature of seeing celestial objects like the Sun and stars. Participants explore concepts related to perception, the passage of light, and the implications of relativity on our understanding of "seeing." The conversation includes elements of humor and philosophical inquiry.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question the nature of seeing, particularly whether looking at the Sun means one is truly seeing it, given the time it takes for light to reach the observer.
  • There are humorous exchanges about the understanding of the Sun as a star and the nature of perception.
  • One participant notes that when looking at a star, one is seeing light emitted in the past, which raises questions about the existence of those stars at the moment of observation.
  • Another participant introduces the idea that the theory of relativity complicates the notion of "right now" in relation to distant objects.
  • Concerns are raised about the limitations of human perception and whether everyone perceives celestial objects in the same way.
  • There is a discussion about the physical and psychological aspects of seeing, including the effects of atmospheric conditions on visibility.
  • One participant elaborates on the limited information collected when observing stars, emphasizing the complexities of light emission and atmospheric interference.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the nature of seeing and perception, with no clear consensus reached. Some agree on the fundamental aspects of light travel and perception, while others challenge or question these ideas, leading to a contested discussion.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes various assumptions about perception and the nature of light, as well as the effects of distance and time on observation. There are unresolved questions regarding the implications of relativity and the biological aspects of seeing.

angel 42
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can you see the stars?

hi, can anyone of you look and see the stars, for example, can you see the sun?
kind of a puzzle:confused:
lets see what do you think
 
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I don't have wireless, so I'm stuck inside, and all I can see through the window is... trees, flowers and grass. Already not that bad actually :smile:

Did they move the stars lately, or why do you inquire ?
 
We had some bad thunderstorms lately so I doubt I can see anything. I'm not going out to look, but I can't see stars/sun from my window.
 
Did they move the stars lately, or why do you inquire ?[/QUOTE]


it's a 100% physics talking, there's a point just think
 
Are you trying to figure out whether or not we're aware that the Sun is a star? :rolleyes:

- Warren
 
chroot said:
Are you trying to figure out whether or not we're aware that the Sun is a star? :rolleyes:

- Warren


WHAT! No, I thought it was a giant Planter's Cheese Puff!:biggrin:
 
chroot said:
Are you trying to figure out whether or not we're aware that the Sun is a star? :rolleyes:

no I'm not, I know as you do that the sun is a star and there are other 10000000... stars, but my Q is when you go out and look at that round sun do you think that you are seeing it really?

lets figuer out who's the cliver here
 
angel 42 said:
lets figuer out who's the cliver here

I think I have that sussed :rolleyes:
 
angel 42 said:
no I'm not, I know as you do that the sun is a star and there are other 10000000... stars, but my Q is when you go out and look at that round sun do you think that you are seeing it really?

lets figuer out who's the cliver here
You're seeing it approx. 8 minutes later.
 
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  • #10
Yes when I look at the sun I think that I'm really seeing it. Except for the perceived size that's smaller than actual due to the sun being far away. I'm confused :confused:.
 
  • #11
I think Evo cracked it. It all makes sense now.
 
  • #12
By the definition of "seeing", i.e. your eyes are receiving light from the object and your brain is processing it, you do see the sun.

I am lost at where this is going??:confused:
 
  • #13
G01 said:
By the definition of "seeing", i.e. your eyes are receiving light from the object and your brain is processing it, you do see the sun.

I am lost at where this is going??:confused:
When you look at a star, you are seeing the light that it gave off in the past, how long ago depends on the distance. Some stars that we "see" today may no longer exist.
 
  • #14
Well, the theory of relativity abolishes the notion of absolute time. It is meaningless to ask about the state of a distant object "right now," as the concept of "right now" doesn't extend beyond your own frame of reference.

- Warren
 
  • #15
angel 42 said:
chroot said:
my Q is when you go out and look at that round sun do you think that you are seeing it really?
When you put it that way, the answer is definitely yes. When I go out and look at that round sun, I think that I am seeing it really. Do you think am I really looking at that round sun?
 
  • #16
Evo said:
You're seeing it approx. 8 minutes later.

bingo, but still missing a part of the correct answer what do you see??
 
  • #17
chroot said:
Well, the theory of relativity abolishes the notion of absolute time. It is meaningless to ask about the state of a distant object "right now," as the concept of "right now" doesn't extend beyond your own frame of reference.

- Warren
What if the distant star is stationary in my frame?
 
  • #18
angel 42 said:
bingo, but ...
Bingo is played differently in my neighborhood.
 
  • #19
jimmysnyder said:
What if the distant star is stationary in my frame?

The Sun is not stationary in your frame.

- Warren
 
  • #20
When you put it that way, the answer is definitely yes. When I go out and look at that round sun, I think that I am seeing it really. Do you think am I really looking at that round sun?[/QUOTE]



no I and you aren't looking at it? :wink:
 
  • #21
angel 42 said:
bingo, but still missing a part of the correct answer what do you see??
I see dead people

Light?
 
  • #22
angel 42 said:
no I and you aren't looking at it? :wink:
When I am not looking at the sun, I don't see it.
 
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  • #23
Light?[/QUOTE]

no, :rolleyes:
 
  • #24
angel 42 said:
hi, can anyone of you look and see the stars, for example, can you see the sun?

I asked my niece, and the answer is an unqualified 'no'. Then again, she's stone blind. :rolleyes:
 
  • #25
Evo said:
I see dead people

Wow, post 21. That's pathetic, guys.

I want to know: have you ever seen the rain?
 
  • #26
I can't see the sun or the ocean or the trees... They are all hiding underneath their surface.
 
  • #27
russ_watters said:
I want to know: have you ever seen the rain?
OK, I want to know who is REALLY cliver. I mean you are going to have to be so cliver to get this.

Do you (you!) feel like I do ?

Think about that for a while, as I pat mself on the back.

(Evrone here try to learn a little physicis an be not so defenisiv)
 
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  • #28
russ_watters said:
. . .I want to know: have you ever seen the rain?

I have. It was coming down on a sunny day. Oh and. . .Yeah!

As for the original post, I often wonder if everyone "sees" things the same. In school once, I colored in a picture and made my sun yellow. It looked right to me. The child next to me made his sun black and then told me mine was wrong. We have the physical side of the question (light and the movement of the object through space and time), but then there is the biological and psychological sides (perception). Do we all perceive the sun the same? I don't know.
 
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  • #29
russ_watters said:
Wow, post 21. That's pathetic, guys.

I want to know: have you ever seen the rain?

Better than that. I've seen the snow on a sunny day ... in June (we've had a really strange summer - I've never seen this much snow on Pikes Peak this late in the year and a lot of the mountain jeep trails are still impassable due to snow).

The only problem I have with the original post is that there's nothing really special about seeing the Sun. You see it the same way you see anything else and it always takes time for light to pass from the object you're seeing to you.

So, either the delay is a natural part of 'seeing' something and we do see the Sun, or else you're rendering the word 'seeing' useless, 'feeling' useless, 'hearing' useless, etc, since you always perceive something in the past vs. the present.
 
  • #30
Of course you don't see the whole sun... the blue portion is spread throughout the sky, so when looking at the sun you only see a portion of it, because a portion of it (evenly spread throughout) can actually be seen where you aren't looking
 

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