Is Physics a Profitable Career Choice?

[tommyburgey]

I know people may reply saying that it's not to do with money and it's for enjoyment, your interests and blah blah blah but as I'm at an early stage of my life, just about to start a-levels, should I not aim for something a little more profitable like medicine for example. I've always been interested in physics but for it's difficulty and importance you'd think it would have loads of money in it. I don't want to end up teaching as I hate over inquisitive kids like myself.

Thanks, Tom.

 

[ZapperZ]

http://www.aip.org/statistics/

I am starting to think that we may need to put this in a sticky somewhere, at the rate that question like this is being asked.

Zz.

 

[jtbell]

should I not aim for something a little more profitable like medicine for example.

How about medical physics? Then you can have it both ways. I hear medical physicists make good money, although maybe not as much as (medical) doctors.

 

[daveb]

A certified medical physicist can make upwards of 150k per year once they become certified (but getting certified is the tough part).

 

[Capt_Jet23]

When are people going to learn that money doesn't matter?

 

[JasonRox]

When are people going to learn that money doesn't matter?

When are you going to learn that it does?

 

[Locrian]

http://www.aip.org/statistics/

I am starting to think that we may need to put this in a sticky somewhere, at the rate that question like this is being asked.

Zz.

Thanks for posting the link. However, I would like to warn readers who look at it to be careful how they interpret that information. Firstly:

It is based on a biennial survey of a sample of U.S.-resident members of the American Institute of Physics (AIP) Member Societies conducted by the Statistical Research Center of AIP.

The AIP data is a "sample" of their members, not a sample of physicists. Are those physicists who dislike their job and are not happy with the way their career turned out as likely to be a member of the AIP as those for whom everything has gone smoothly? How well this sample actually reflects what physicists as a group make is completely unknown.

I would also disagree with the lumping of all physics disciplines into one area of "physics". It makes as much sense to ask what a physicist in a university makes as it does to ask what a businessman makes. A bookkeeper, vacuum salesman and CEO are all businessmen, and they have wildly varying salaries. The salaries at universities vary as well, and they largely do so by discipline, not by length of time they've stayed.

Finally, the question of whether there is money in physics is not answered by median incomes. It is answered by median lifetime incomes. People pay a hefty price in lost wages by going to extra school, and lifetime earnings are a reasonable way of seeing how well it pays off. I know many students who will make $65,000 a year. . . after 11 years of school, 8 years of postdoc, and several years at the bottom of the teaching pool. That is not the same financially as making $65k after 6 years of school.

For these reasons - and especially the last one - I do not believe the AIP actually answers the question asked in the OP. While I do not consider the AIP statistics "wrong" exactly, I believe they can be very misleading to almost anyone who casually looks at them.

Reader beware.

 

[Locrian]

I've always been interested in physics but for it's difficulty and importance you'd think it would have loads of money in it.

Difficulty and perceived importance have little to do with what a profession makes. You would also be wise to break physics down into its respective professions, rather than erroneously trying to treat it as a profession itself.

 

[ZapperZ]

Thanks for posting the link. However, I would like to warn readers who look at it to be careful how they interpret that information. Firstly:

The AIP data is a "sample" of their members, not a sample of physicists. Are those physicists who dislike their job and are not happy with the way their career turned out as likely to be a member of the AIP as those for whom everything has gone smoothly? How well this sample actually reflects what physicists as a group make is completely unknown.

I would also disagree with the lumping of all physics disciplines into one area of "physics". It makes as much sense to ask what a physicist in a university makes as it does to ask what a businessman makes. A bookkeeper, vacuum salesman and CEO are all businessmen, and they have wildly varying salaries. The salaries at universities vary as well, and they largely do so by discipline, not by length of time they've stayed.

Finally, the question of whether there is money in physics is not answered by median incomes. It is answered by median lifetime incomes. People pay a hefty price in lost wages by going to extra school, and lifetime earnings are a reasonable way of seeing how well it pays off. I know many students who will make $65,000 a year. . . after 11 years of school, 8 years of postdoc, and several years at the bottom of the teaching pool. That is not the same financially as making $65k after 6 years of school.

For these reasons - and especially the last one - I do not believe the AIP actually answers the question asked in the OP. While I do not consider the AIP statistics "wrong" exactly, I believe they can be very misleading to almost anyone who casually looks at them.

Reader beware.

Still, the AIP statistics give THE BEST collected data as the starting point. Beyond that, it is speculation and guess work.

BTW, the AIP polls graduating students and APS memberships. One doesn't actually become a "member" of AIP.

Zz.

 

[Timo]

I know people may reply saying that it's not to do with money and it's for enjoyment, your interests and blah blah blah but as I'm at an early stage of my life, just about to start a-levels, should I not aim for something a little more profitable like medicine for example.

Such statements imho mainly focus on doing physics at international university research level. If you're interest in making money, you can go into industry where the wages are relatively high. Especially since physicists can often work in related or relatively unrelated fields in which there is a higher demand for people than specialists available on the market (e.g. in the past as programmers or as statisticans for ensurance companies). You also see physicists in management positions.
In short: Going into physics doesn't necessarily mean you'll have to do 60h/week with below-industry level payment later on.

I've always been interested in physics but for it's difficulty and importance you'd think it would have loads of money in it.

There is a lot of money in physics research. The amounts of money put into some experiments (large projects like particle colliders, observatories or experiments conducted in space) is tremendous. It's just that a lot of money is spent and designated for equipment (even in theoretical physics where you sometimes end up working on the newest and most powerful desktop computers available when a slightly less modern computer costing half the money would do the trick, too).

 

[Niles]

http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/print/1294

This article is about physicists in the financial world.

A physicist with great programming skills (particulary C/C++) and great math-skills will have good opportunities of getting a lucrative career as an analyst.

 

[tommyburgey]

Thanks for the advise, I'll probably:

1. Try for medicine, become a doctor, rake in the money and do physics when I retire.
2. Try for medicine, fail, go for physics
3. Fail medicine, fail physics...become a bum.

 

[symbolipoint]

Thanks for the advise, I'll probably:

1. Try for medicine, become a doctor, rake in the money and do physics when I retire.
2. Try for medicine, fail, go for physics
3. Fail medicine, fail physics...become a bum.

Very nice set of priorities. Here is another approach using your #1 and #2: Earn an undergraduate or more degree in Physics; then try for Medicine. If the approach into medicine does not work, then try for medical physics.

 

[mathwonk]

money! ptooie!

 

[ekrim]

money! ptooie!

exactly. it's only a big factor if you enjoy buying stuff more than physics

 

[G01]

1. Try for medicine, become a doctor, rake in the money and do physics when I retire.

Just so you are aware doctors don't just "rake in the money." Many specialties can make a good amount of money, but you work your...well you know... off for it. I am not a doctor myself but I have family members and friends that are doctors and in other health care professions and I guarantee you that if the only thing you care about is the money, you will be miserable in medicine and health care. You have to love medicine in order to excel at it.

 

[imabug]

There's a saying among medical physicists in radiation therapy that goes something like

Physicians kill people one at a time. Medical physicists kill people in batches.

Like medicine, you really have to enjoy and want to do medical physics, particularly if you're going into therapy. Sloppy work and bad attitudes can be potentially lethal to whole groups of patients.

 

[proton]

if you want money so badly you can always try to become a dentist. They can make over 100k a year. Its not as competitive as med school too. Too bad there's little if any math/physics involved

 

[mathwonk]

I hear there is more money in selling crack.

 

[Feldoh]

I hear there is more money in selling crack.

I knew I picked the right profession!

 

[DefaultName]

It depends on what you do with your knowledge.

 

[Mins]

should I not aim for something a little more profitable like medicine for example. I've always been interested in physics but for it's difficulty and importance you'd think it would have loads of money in it.

You've got to remember lots of things, like names of chemicals, medicines, etc. I won't do it, 'cause I'm not that into medicine. That's why I study physics.

 

[mathwonk]

why not become a real estate broker, or tv evangelist, or loan officer, or arms dealer?

 

[Mins]

why not become a real estate broker, or tv evangelist, or loan officer, or arms dealer?

Brokers don't earn that much money(and I'm not a sales person).
Don't know what tv evangelist is.
I heard that jobs related to economy requires as much mathematics as physics(or is it just a rumor?)
Arms dealer would be great, but I don't have any money to start with.

So I prefer being a scientist.(maybe I'll try those jobs later on)

 

[SugarMagnolia]

Just to add in some... well I love Medical Physics, so my opinion on your dilemma. If you go to medical school, you're going to be very far in debt when you get done. If you go to a Medical Physics graduate program, you'll probably at least get tuition waived, and most likely get a stipend of some sort on top of that. Doctors have terribly erratic hours. If you go into radiation oncology (medical physics specialty) your hours are much more regular and you still get the medical experience. If you're interested in that. I love medicine, but didn't like the insane hours of a doctor (long hours are fine, just being on call is what would drive me batty), the loan money I would have as a fresh MD, and the stress of the job. Talk to people in both fields. That's how I made my decision. In my experience, people who are medical physicists are very happy. I've heard very many things to the contrary regarding the average doctor. It's not all about the money, as someone said, but it is a consideration. You'll get nowhere in life if you do it all for the money, so why not, if money is so important, find something that combines your interests with the potential to make money? It seems to me like medical physics would be great for you. But don't do it just for the money or you'll be miserable. If you want to help people, use applied Physics, and not have to spend 5-7 years getting a PhD and then a postdoc afterwards, look into a masters in medical physics.

 

[misterme09]

Medical physics does sound amazing...but what is involved in being accepted to a MS or PhD program in medical physics? How tough are admissions? Are they as competitive as med school admissions?

 

[tommyburgey]

I've just realized that I'm not interested in medicine in the slightest I'm just attracted to being "A Doctor". That's just stupid so I'm just gunna follow my interests, who cares about saving lives...
Thanks for the advice

 

[imabug]

Medical physics does sound amazing...but what is involved in being accepted to a MS or PhD program in medical physics? How tough are admissions? Are they as competitive as med school admissions?

Depends on where you are. In the US and Canada, admission can be tough, but mostly because of an increasing demand and limited supply. Probably not as hard as getting into med school. As long as you have decent GRE scores and GPA and are really interested, you can probably find a spot somewhere. For details, you should contact the program coordinator at the places you're interested.

Studying medical physics is easy. Being a good medical physicist is hard. Because of the wide array of people and technologies medical physicists deal with, they tend to be (by necessity) something of a jack of all trades (particularly those in the clinical environment), so adaptability and quick learning are some key abilities to have.

What is a [URL='https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/become-medical-physicist-3653-easy-steps/']medical physicist[/URL]
CAMPEP accredited graduate programs
CAMPEP accredited residencies
Non-CAMPEP accredited programs

 

[SugarMagnolia]

As far as difficulty getting into programs goes...

Here is my undergraduate CV, briefly:
I'm a girl, 3.4 GPA, 1360 I believe on the GRE, I did 2 REU research programs as an undergraduate, and 1 research project on my campus, double major in physics/math

I got into all 5 programs I applied to, including 2 that were accredited (though I hear that currently it doesn't matter all that much, though it probably will in the future, but by then most schools will be accredited).

My GPA was far from outstanding, my GRE scores were also far from outstanding. I think what helped me is I had very good letters of recommendation from my research, and I had been in contact with a few professors in a couple different programs regarding questions I had, showing interest. I'm not sure if that all helped, but something did. I know I'm not an outstanding student. The program I'm in had 50 applicants, and there are about 6 of us in the program. So, I'm not sure exactly what kind of applicants the others were... It's not an easy thing for me to say, but realistically, I'm sure being a girl helped.