News Is Sarkozy addressing the ongoing violence in French suburbs effectively?

[Anttech]

France does have a very strange method of assimilation. It is illegal in France to even count immigrants.. France has always had some racial problems also.. And it looks like this past and methodology is catching up with them... It seems there republic method doesn't work, and will need changing.

One of the things I love about London is its diversity, I am not saying the UK does immigration perfectly, but they absorb different cultures and then that culture becomes part of ours.. Look at the British "National" dish for an example: Curry.

France needs to start listening to these people and stop ignoring the fact that they are being treated as second class citizens or this problem will keep coming back to haunt them... The Unemployment rates in the ghettos are twice that of the national average, this says something in its-self...

 

[El Hombre Invisible]

One of the things I love about London is its diversity, I am not saying the UK does immigration perfectly, but they absorb different cultures and then that culture becomes part of ours.. Look at the British "National" dish for an example: Curry.

France needs to start listening to these people and stop ignoring the fact that they are being treated as second class citizens or this problem will keep coming back to hunt them... The Unemployment rates in the ghettos are twice that of the national average, this says something in its-self...

Yeah, but France already had a great cuisine before the influx of Indian chefs. Us Brits had some meat prepared by a special technique called "cooking with no particular thought", vegetables boiled with a pinch of salt, and a flexible sauce called "gravy" that was just left over from cooking the meat. We desparately needed immigration so we could have dinners out and takeaways.

 

[Anttech]

Actually some British food is great:

Examples:

Lamb hot Pot
Steak Pies
Fish
Sunday Roasts
Shepards pie
(deep fried Mars bars haha)

 

[Art]

Here's a link to a very good opinion piece regarding the problems in France which I think is well worth a read for those interested in the background leading up to the riots.

The Problem with Frenchness

Readers have asked me for comment about the riots in France that have now provoked emergency laws and a curfew. What I would rather comment on, however, is the myths that have governed many rightwing American comments on the tragic events. Actually, I can only think that the disturbances must produce a huge ice cream headache for the dittoheads. French of European heritage pitted against French of African and North African heritage? How could they ever pick a side?

http://www.juancole.com/2005/11/problem-with-frenchness-readers-have.html

 

[Anttech]

very sober opinion... Nice link

 

[loseyourname]

That was a very good link, Art. Something I've found informative is the NPR Page on the French riots. The archive goes back a couple of days and includes reports and, more importantly I think, interviews with many French people on both sides of the issue.

 

[vanesch]

Again, I would like to point out that in these violent riots, a small minority of people was actually involved which caused a lot of damage, and the main problem is in the long build-up of "unlawfulness" in these quarters, much more than "racial discrimination" or other often invoked problems (which ALSO exist, but have no direct link).

In a recent article in Liberation:

http://www.liberation.fr/page.php?Article=338547

it is said that of the 2838 arrested people during the riots, 80% (EIGHTY PERCENT) is known by the police already for drug traffic and other underground economy activities.

This clearly proves that it is a matter of GANGS (organized crime) and NOT a matter of popular riots, racism, or whatever. Of course these gangs (which indeed mainly consist of youngsters of North-African decent) have all interest to shift the spotlight to racism or other topics.

 

[Art]

Again, I would like to point out that in these violent riots, a small minority of people was actually involved which caused a lot of damage, and the main problem is in the long build-up of "unlawfulness" in these quarters, much more than "racial discrimination" or other often invoked problems (which ALSO exist, but have no direct link).
In a recent article in Liberation:
http://www.liberation.fr/page.php?Article=338547
it is said that of the 2838 arrested people during the riots, 80% (EIGHTY PERCENT) is known by the police already for drug traffic and other underground economy activities.
This clearly proves that it is a matter of GANGS (organized crime) and NOT a matter of popular riots, racism, or whatever. Of course these gangs (which indeed mainly consist of youngsters of North-African decent) have all interest to shift the spotlight to racism or other topics.

I do not think it is as clear as that. We would need to know under what circumstances the 2838 people were arrested. If the police simply picked up everybody they had a file on or suspected were gang members then the fact they have records is simply a circular argument.

 

[vanesch]

I do not think it is as clear as that. We would need to know under what circumstances the 2838 people were arrested. If the police simply picked up everybody they had a file on or suspected were gang members then the fact they have records is simply a circular argument.

As far as I understand (not in the article, but it was on the radio too), these were arrests made "on the spot" of people rioting - at least that is what I understood.