News Is Shirvell's Firing Justified for Harassing a Publicly-Elected Official?

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AI Thread Summary
The discussion centers around the firing of an assistant attorney general in Michigan, who was dismissed not for his speech but for actions deemed inappropriate, including stalking and harassment. The First Amendment protects free speech from government infringement, but it does not guarantee employment, particularly when an employee's conduct violates workplace policies. The assistant AG's termination followed a disciplinary hearing where he was found guilty of misconduct, including misusing state resources and lying during the investigation. Participants in the discussion emphasize that while Shirvell's speech may be protected, his actions crossed a line that justified his firing. The conversation also touches on the complexities of free speech rights in the context of government employment versus private employment, highlighting that government employees have certain protections that do not extend to private sector employees. The thread reflects a broader debate about the limits of free speech, especially when it involves harassment or misconduct in a professional setting.
  • #51
D H said:
Oh, please. Do you have any more non sequiturs to throw around?

Why is that a non sequitur? Legally speaking, what is the difference between Shirvell harassing the guy at UM and the Petkovs harassing their neighbors?
 
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  • #52
turbo-1 said:
He did things (actions) that went far beyond free speech, and crossed over into stalking and harassment, if the news accounts are accurate. That is enough to get him fired. Is there a good reason to parse all the arguments about why he should have been fired?
So is this an issue of free speech violations? It was stated that he wasn't fired for what he did on the job?

Closing thread and deleting OT posts if evidence showing that the AG's office did not say he was fired for what he did on the job. This isn't about "what if" or "maybe if", this is about what has been stated as reason.
 
  • #53
nickyrtr said:
Why is that a non sequitur? Legally speaking, what is the difference between Shirvell harassing the guy at UM and the Petkovs harassing their neighbors?
Let me count the ways:
  1. The target of the Petkovs harassment was a child. Shirvell's target was an adult.
  2. The Petkov's adult targets were private citizens. Shirvell's target was an adult who held a publicly-elected position. That it was a ridiculously lowly position is irrelevant. The Supreme Court makes a big distinction between adult elected public officials from private citizens.
  3. Harassment is not protected speech. The disciplinary hearing found exactly that regarding Shirvell's activities at 1:30 AM are not protected speech.
 
  • #54
D H said:
Let me count the ways:
  1. The target of the Petkovs harassment was a child. Shirvell's target was an adult.
  2. The Petkov's adult targets were private citizens. Shirvell's target was an adult who held a publicly-elected position. That it was a ridiculously lowly position is irrelevant. The Supreme Court makes a big distinction between adult elected public officials from private citizens.
  3. Harassment is not protected speech. The disciplinary hearing found exactly that regarding Shirvell's activities at 1:30 AM are not protected speech.
Publicly elected official? He was President of the student body of a University. He was not a publicly elected official.

This thread is closed.
 
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