Is the Expression Dimensionally Consistent?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the dimensional consistency of two expressions involving potential energy and force in a mechanical context. Participants explore the dimensions of various components and their implications for the validity of the equations presented.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses uncertainty about the dimensions of potential energy (U) and the variable delta (δ), noting a lack of definitions for these components.
  • Another participant calculates the dimensions of U and suggests that if δ has units of length, then the first expression is dimensionally consistent.
  • There is a reiteration of the dimensional analysis for U, confirming that pressure (E) has units of force per area, leading to the conclusion that δ must also be length for consistency.
  • Participants agree that both terms in the second expression must be consistent with the left side, but there is uncertainty about the dimensionality of the second term involving mg and ℓ.
  • One participant suggests that the second term is inconsistent due to the additional factor of ℓ, which is not dimensionless, while another confirms this reasoning.
  • There is a consensus that δ likely has units of length, which supports the consistency of the first expression.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the first expression is dimensionally consistent if δ is considered a length. However, there is disagreement regarding the second expression, with some participants asserting it is inconsistent due to the presence of ℓ, while others express uncertainty about the implications of this factor.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that scalar constants can be ignored in dimensional analysis, but there is ongoing uncertainty about the specific definitions and roles of δ and ℓ in the context of the equations.

GreenGoblin
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Which of the following are dimensionally consistent:

U = \frac{EA\delta^{2}}{2\ell}, F = \frac{EA\delta}{l} + mg\ell.

Right so. I get the concept, but the thing is I don't have (nor do I know where to find) expressions for each of these components. A is area so that is L^{2}. E is a 'pressure' which I have as ML^{-1}T^{-2}. This is never having done any mechanicsy type stuff before. l is just length. But thing is U is a 'potential energy', which I have no expretion for so I don't know the LHS of the first which is kind of the point of what I need to do. I also don't know what to do with a scalar multiple (the 1/2)? if this affects it at all? And the delta, I have no indication what it represents.
 
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1.) $\displaystyle U=\frac{EA\delta^2}{2L}$

Since you state $U$ is energy, which is $\displaystyle \frac{\text{mass}\times\text{length}^2}{\text{time}^2}$, let's see what $\delta$ must be if there is dimensional consistency.

Pressure is force per area, so $EA$ has units of force or $\displaystyle \frac{\text{mass}\times\text{length}}{\text{time}^2}$

Scalar constants may be ignored as they are dimensionless.

So we are left with:

$\displaystyle \text{length}=\frac{\delta^2}{\text{length}}$

So, if the units of $\delta$ are length, then it is consistent.

Can you try the second one?
 
MarkFL said:
1.) $\displaystyle U=\frac{EA\delta^2}{2L}$

Since you state $U$ is energy, which is $\displaystyle \frac{\text{mass}\times\text{length}^2}{\text{time}^2}$, let's see what $\delta$ must be if there is dimensional consistency.

Pressure is force per area, so $EA$ has units of force or $\displaystyle \frac{\text{mass}\times\text{length}}{\text{time}^2}$

Scalar constants may be ignored as they are dimensionless.

So we are left with:

$\displaystyle \text{length}=\frac{\delta^2}{\text{length}}$

So, if the units of $\delta$ are length, then it is consistent.

Can you try the second one?
Hi, thanks a lot. In the second, we have two terms. I take it both would have to be consistent? I.e. then the RHS would be 2 x (whatever) which has dimension of (whatever). I get that the first term is consistent, but the 2nd is not.. if g has the dimension of acceleration which I believe is correct? Also, is delta being length likely to make sense? I have no indication of what delta should represent.
 
I suspect that $\delta$ does have units of length, and so the first is consistent.

You are correct on the second one, both terms on the right have to be consistent with the left side. The first term is consistent as you discovered, but unless the factor $\ell$ is dimensionless, then this second term is not consistent. By Newton's second law, we know $mg$ is a force.
 
MarkFL said:
I suspect that $\delta$ does have units of length, and so the first is consistent.

You are correct on the second one, both terms on the right have to be consistent with the left side. The first term is consistent as you discovered, but unless the factor $\ell$ is dimensionless, then this second term is not consistent. By Newton's second law, we know $mg$ is a force.
Yes I noticed that the 2nd term is just ma = F but multiplied by an additional l which makes it inconsistent. I thank you for your help and I am confident with this question now. I decided to accept delta as a length, it makes more sense that way. Gracias.
 

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