Is There Mathematical Proof That Stars Are Still Being Formed?

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    Astrophysics Olympiad
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether there is a mathematical proof that stars are still being formed. Participants explore the implications of observational evidence and theoretical frameworks related to star formation, longevity, and the age of the universe.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that while observational evidence for ongoing star formation exists, a mathematical proof may not be feasible, as it would likely rely on observational data.
  • Another participant proposes that demonstrating the lifetimes of certain stars being shorter than the age of the universe could imply that stars must still be forming, but acknowledges this relies on observational evidence and does not rule out the possibility of star formation ceasing at any moment.
  • A different participant expresses interest in the question and acknowledges its complexity without providing specific arguments.
  • One participant reiterates the original question and suggests that if stars can be found with luminosities indicating they are younger than the Sun, it could imply ongoing star formation, hinting at a potential mathematical proof using the provided equations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether a mathematical proof exists for ongoing star formation. There are competing views regarding the reliance on observational evidence versus theoretical implications.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the limitations of relying on observational evidence and the assumptions involved in linking star lifetimes to the age of the universe. The discussion remains open-ended regarding the mathematical aspects of the question.

Max.Planck
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Hello,

I have a question from the Dutch Astrophysics Olympiad, which I can't solve.

" Is there mathematical proof that stars are still being formed? "

In previous questions, i had to derive the following equations, which i need to use in my answer for the question above:

L = σ * T4 * 4πR2

(Luminosity-Temperature relation of a star, where σ is the Boltzmann constant, T is temperature and R is the radius of the star)

t = life time of sun * (M/Msun)-2,6

(where t equals the life time of a type V star and M equals mass)

Can anyone help me with this?

Thanks,

Max.Planck
 
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Observational evidence? yes. Mathematical proof? don't think so...

I don't see how you can get a mathematical proof for star formation...

Perhaps they are asking you to show that the life-time of some stars is less than that of the age of the universe and therefore if there was no star formation after the BB, we wouldn't see any of those stars...? This still relies on observation (of the massive stars), and it doesn't preclude the possibility that star formation has stopped this instant (rather than billions of years in the past).

I honestly can't think of any proof that would both not rely on observational evidence, and preclude the possibility of star formation stopping this instant.

Maybe I'm missing something here haha...
 


Yeah it's a very interesting question ;] And a hard one indeed. It will be interesting to find out the answer.
 


Max.Planck said:
Hello,

I have a question from the Dutch Astrophysics Olympiad, which I can't solve.

" Is there mathematical proof that stars are still being formed? "

In previous questions, i had to derive the following equations, which i need to use in my answer for the question above:

L = σ * T4 * 4πR2

(Luminosity-Temperature relation of a star, where σ is the Boltzmann constant, T is temperature and R is the radius of the star)

t = life time of sun * (M/Msun)-2,6

(where t equals the life time of a type V star and M equals mass)

Can anyone help me with this?

Thanks,

Max.Planck

lets think about it...
Luminosity is the amount of energy released by time...
and that life time you found I suppose is the time that the star spend in the Main Sequence, right? so actually if you find some stars, that you measure its luminosity and with this you would calculate that it would actually spend some Myears in the MS, so it means that they are younger than the Sun and actually stars are being created. So maybe, yes you can proove it mathematically, but I don't have here a paper and a pencil to write down things, but I think it is possible, with this 2 relations
 

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