Is this non-integrable function integrable using numerical methods?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the integrability of the function defined by the integral \(\int e^{2 \pi i \left( x^3+ax^2+bx \right) } dx\). Participants explore whether this integral is integrable using numerical methods, the implications of the imaginary exponent, and potential techniques for evaluation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses uncertainty about the integrability of the integral, comparing it to the known non-integrable function \(\int e^{-x^2} dx\).
  • Another participant clarifies that "non-integrable" can be misleading, as \(e^{-x^2}\) is integrable but not expressible in elementary functions, suggesting the integral might be approached in the complex plane due to the imaginary exponent.
  • A different participant proposes the possibility of using hypergeometric functions for the integral.
  • One suggestion is to separate the real and imaginary parts of the integrand using Euler's formula for easier integration.
  • Another participant questions the feasibility of integrating the sine and cosine components of the function, indicating a lack of clarity on how to proceed.
  • A suggestion is made to apply integration by parts to see if it simplifies the integral.
  • A participant claims that the function can be simplified to a constant due to the properties of \(e^{2\pi i}\), leading to the conclusion that the integral is simply \(x + C\), though this assertion is challenged by others.
  • Another participant disputes the simplification, arguing that it overlooks the complexities involved in Fourier transforms and the nature of complex integrals.
  • One participant suggests using a Taylor series expansion for the function, as it allows for term-by-term integration.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the integrability of the function or the validity of the simplifications proposed. Multiple competing views and methods are presented, indicating an unresolved discussion.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the assumptions made about the function's properties and the implications of using complex analysis. The mathematical steps and definitions involved in the proposed methods remain unresolved.

Severian
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I am interested in the integral

[tex]\int e^{2 \pi i \left( x^3+ax^2+bx \right) } dx[/tex]

Since [tex]\int e^{-x^2} dx[/tex] is non-integrable, I suspect this integral may be too, but I am not so sure because of the exponent being imaginary. Does anyone know?

If it is integrable, does anyone have any idea how to go about solving it?

If it is not integrable, does anyone have any idea how to most efficiently evaluate it numerically (from say 0 to an arbitrary [tex]x_0[/tex])?
 
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Be careful about the term "non-integrable". Strictly speaking, any continuous function, such as [itex]e^{-x^2}[/itex] is "integrable". It's just that its integral is not any "elementary function". [itex]e^{-x^2}[/itex] certainly is integrable- its integral is the error function, Erf(x).

Since I notice an "i" in your integral, it looks like it would be more appropriate to integrate it in the Complex plane.
 
Yes, of course [tex]e^{-x^2}[/tex] is integrable. Silly me!

Some sort of hypergeometric maybe?
 
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I suggest integrating the real and complex parts separately. These are easily separable by Euler's formula.
 
That doesn't really help much because I still don't know how to do [tex]\int \sin \left[ 2\pi (x^3+ax^2+bx ) \right] dx[/tex] or its cosine counterpart.
 
Severian said:
I am interested in the integral

[tex]\int e^{2 \pi i \left( x^3+ax^2+bx \right) } dx[/tex]
Does anyone know?

You could try applying integration by parts twice, and seeing if you get something that cancels, since you'll get a sign chance by pulling the i out of the exponent twice.
 
Hey Severian, is this the same one from Scienceforums.net? Its Ragib from there.

I believe the function you described is a constant since the function could be rewritten as [tex](e^{2\pi i})^{x^3+ax^2+bx}[/tex]. Since e^(2*pi*i) is equal to 1, and 1 to the power of anything is 1, I think we have a constant valued function, this should be easy from there, If i am correct.

EDIT: btw, as you prob know, the integral is then x + C.
 
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^ That isn't true in general. By that logic, Fourier transforms would be much simpler than they are. Infact, if it were true, anything which is of the form

[tex]\int f(x)e^{ikx}dx[/tex]

would be

[tex]2\pi \int f(2\pi y)e^{i2\pi k y}dy = 2\pi \int f(2\pi y)(e^{2\pi i})^{ky}dy = 2\pi \int f(2\pi y)dy = \int f(x) dx[/tex]

This would mean that Fourier transforming something is just integrating it. That's obviously not true. It's true if you were integrating the modulus of the integrand, but you're not. Instead you're considering it's complex value. So while you'd have

[tex]\int |e^{2\pi i kx}| dx = \int dx = x+c[/tex]

You get something else when you don't have the | | signs.
 
Aww ok then, I am not going to be of any help here then.
 
  • #10
you might try the taylor series for your function, as they are easy to integrate term by term.
 

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