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News Is Wells Fargo "a criminal enterprise"?

  1. Sep 29, 2016 #1

    nsaspook

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  2. jcsd
  3. Sep 29, 2016 #2

    Bystander

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    Thee and me, both.
     
  4. Sep 30, 2016 #3

    Borg

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    Every four months, I use the official government site to get my free credit report from one of the three reporting agencies. We also keep credit card receipts and validate them against the monthly statement. The same goes for all of our banking statements. If I had been a Wells Fargo customer, I would have spotted it quickly and dealt with it immeadiately - including the activation of a fraud alert with all three agencies.
     
  5. Sep 30, 2016 #4

    russ_watters

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    Yes, and while I don't know the full details/history, it surprises me that they haven't been raided by the FBI yet. I think they are the next ENRON.
     
  6. Sep 30, 2016 #5

    Bystander

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    It surprises me that Comey and the "Feebs" haven't been raided yet.
     
  7. Sep 30, 2016 #6

    russ_watters

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    They are not feeble, they are picky based on politics. Drugs? OK. Abuse of classified information? Not a problem. Illegal immigration [different department, but same problem]? Back off. But that's part of why I am so surprised: bankers are enemy #1.
     
  8. Sep 30, 2016 #7
    Trouble is Wells Fargo is just the one that got caught. Most banks are doing something shady. 2008 taught them nothing. I hope Wells Fargo goes down. What they did was pretty much unthinkable. I don't know how any could bank with them again. What makes me think they will survive just fine is that their stock has not crashed.
     
  9. Sep 30, 2016 #8

    russ_watters

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    That's probably "too big to fail" hubris. And they may be right: it is really really hard to shut down a bank. You can't just shut down, close all the accounts and send everyone a check for what is in their account -- that money doesn't exist (it's been loaned-out).

    What would have to happen is that the government has to wipe out the shareholder value and force them to sell the company for pennies (a la 2008).
     
  10. Sep 30, 2016 #9
    The bank shuts down when there is a run to close accounts by members. I think this is a case where most WF account owners are clueless.
     
  11. Sep 30, 2016 #10

    russ_watters

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    Yeah, I get that. [google] In 2008, the banks failed, were siezed by the government because there was no other choice, and then sold. This time, they would have to be siezed without first failing, which they would almost certainly fight.
     
  12. Sep 30, 2016 #11

    mheslep

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    That's 6,799 FDIC insured US banks (as Feb 2014) doing the shady. Govt owned Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac too, underwriting the paper for almost all US mortgages now.
     
  13. Sep 30, 2016 #12

    vela

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    I don't get why there hasn't been a mass exodus from Wells Fargo by its customers, particularly by the ones who were victims of the fraud.
     
  14. Oct 1, 2016 #13

    mheslep

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    New checks, new credit cards, new online bill pay, ....
     
  15. Oct 1, 2016 #14

    Vanadium 50

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    One could argue that they are the bank that is being looked at most closely, and therefore the safest. Now, anyway.

    But it has - it's lost $28B in market cap. For which they pay Mr. Stumpf tens of millions of dollars. (Heck, I could do that for a fraction of the cost!) This is the problem with weak boards, and I hope every last one of them has the pants sued off for failing in their fiduciary duty. I don't believe Mr. Stumpf was aware of the situation, but it was his job to be aware. He failed at that, and as a result the shareholders lost billions.
     
  16. Oct 1, 2016 #15

    mheslep

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    Not so many millions as before.

    If the WF board sacks him he looses $23 million in annual compensation going forward, and I doubt he'll be able to do the banking shuffle onto another board. Time for Stumpf to start selling his memoir.
     
  17. Oct 1, 2016 #16

    phinds

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    It's a large, "too big to fail" bank. That it is a criminal enterprise is a tautology.
     
  18. Oct 1, 2016 #17

    Vanadium 50

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    I don't think this is helpful. Do you want banks to think "They will treat us as criminals no matter what, so we might as well..."
     
  19. Oct 1, 2016 #18

    phinds

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    Seems to me they are already doing it AND getting away with it.
     
  20. Oct 2, 2016 #19

    mheslep

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    US has 7000 banks. They are not all Wells Fargo.
     
  21. Oct 2, 2016 #20

    phinds

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    Nor are they all "too big to fail". Please read exactly what I said, not extrapolate it to something I did not say.
     
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