Is Wells Fargo "a criminal enterprise"?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the characterization of Wells Fargo as potentially being a "criminal enterprise," focusing on allegations of unethical practices, the implications of being a large bank, and the broader context of banking behavior. Participants explore various aspects of the scandal, including the company's actions, regulatory responses, and comparisons to other financial institutions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express skepticism about why Wells Fargo has not faced more severe legal consequences, suggesting it could be comparable to past scandals like Enron.
  • Others argue that many banks engage in questionable practices, implying that Wells Fargo is not alone in its misconduct.
  • There is a discussion about the concept of "too big to fail," with some suggesting that this status may shield Wells Fargo from the repercussions that smaller banks would face.
  • Participants note the financial implications of the scandal, including the discrepancy between the profits made from fraudulent accounts and the fines imposed on the bank.
  • Some contributors question the effectiveness of regulatory oversight and whether it is sufficient to deter unethical behavior in large banks.
  • A few participants highlight the lack of a mass exodus of customers from Wells Fargo, speculating on the reasons behind this phenomenon.
  • There are differing views on whether the actions of Wells Fargo's leadership constitute criminal behavior or if they stem from incompetence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether Wells Fargo should be classified as a criminal enterprise. There are multiple competing views regarding the implications of its size, the nature of its actions, and the broader context of banking ethics.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions reference the historical context of banking scandals and the regulatory environment, but these points remain unresolved and depend on varying interpretations of the events and practices discussed.

  • #61
I do have to stand corrected on statement I made. Since 2011 the FDIC has changed the assessment rates to reflect the relative risk of the institution. Now the minimums are about $3-4 per $100. And the problem remains the same, they are both underfunded.
 
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  • #62
Vanadium 50 said:
This is rapidly turning into "Banks are evil. This act is evil. Therefore banks committed this act."

V50, you are an intelligent person. When you examine the facts pertaining to the banking system, you can only draw one conclusion. The banks can engage in risky behavior with no consequence. If the FDIC is incapable of making good its liabilities, history has proven that the government (i.e. the people) will make good the difference. The banks have been continuously bailed out by the taxpayers since the inception of the FDIC.

The first time a government supported a bank in a time of failure was in 1696. There was run on the Bank of England which led to insolvency. The Parliament responded by making a law which suspended the "payment of specie". This means that depositors could not redeem their payments in gold (the standard of currency of the day). The precedent was set, and to this day there is an unholy alliance between govermnents and central banks that defies logic. Just because something is legal, does not make it right.

In the words of the Mayer Amschel Rothschild ( the original bankster), "Give me control over the issuance of a nation's currency, and I care not who makes its laws."
 
  • #63
Kevin, I am afraid your argument is too slippery for me and you keep moving the goalposts. The fact that a bank commits some bad acts does not prove it commits other bad acts, just like the fact that a person is a thief does not allow you to hang him for murder. Fractional reserve banking, "too big to fail" and risky S&L loans in the 1980's have nothing to do with this particular Wells Fargo scandal.
 
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  • #64
Vanadium 50 said:
Kevin, I am afraid your argument is too slippery for me and you keep moving the goalposts. The fact that a bank commits some bad acts does not prove it commits other bad acts, just like the fact that a person is a thief does not allow you to hang him for murder. Fractional reserve banking, "too big to fail" and risky S&L loans in the 1980's have nothing to do with this particular Wells Fargo scandal.

Yes, of course you are right, FR banking has nothing to do with this scandal. Cheers. :cool:
 
  • #65
I used to have a bank account with Wells Fargo 8 months ago. I was incredulous when they took $12 dollars out of my account for no reason. The story: I had transferred some money from savings to checking to buy an item (I can't remember exactly what it was, probably a game to play with some friends) I knew the exact cost of. When I bought the item (online purchase) for the exact amount Wells Fargo gave me an overcharging fee. When I tried to get my my money back because I clearly had not over charged but paid the exact amount the Wells Fargo rep would only give me six dollars back. I was thoroughly upset and resorted to keeping my money away from Wells Fargo. The worst part is that I was powerless to do anything about it. They took the money I had entrusted them with. I can't imagine I am the only one this has happened to.
 
  • #66
The WF CEO was sacked couple days ago.
 
  • #67
But replaced by his right-hand man. Meet the new boss.
 
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  • #68
The bank stands to lose $99 billion in deposits, $4 billion in revenue and a customer base that could dwindle by up to 30 percent, a study released Monday by cg42 showed. Ultimately, about 14 percent of customers are actually projected to switch banks, an at-risk level that a cg42 principal still said is "dramatically higher" than what would be expected from any of Wells Fargo's competitors.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/wells-fargo-fallout-study-says-145943938.html
 
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