Isn’t “kicked out” a derogatory term?

[Adesh]

It is expected from civilised folks to use respectful terms for others. I personally find “kicked out” a very derogatory and insulting remark :-) . How do you see that? (Especially if it is from someone who is classified as civil and meant for someone who is also civil).

 

[Ibix]

It's informal. I don't think it's particularly derogatory. "I was kicked out" just means I was made to leave involuntarily, but that may reflect on my actions or on the actions of the person kicking me out. I have also used it in the context of dropping out of an online meeting due to technical issues ("sorry guys, the network kicked me out" was said by pretty much everybody at my job at some point in the first few days of home working during lockdown).

What's the context for your question?

 

[Klystron]

Understanding whether "kicked out" is derogatory depends on context and the object. In computer science the term does not imply bias or derogation.

The sorter kicked out blank and damaged cards before processing.
After revising input criteria, the program kicked out a list of qualified applicants.

When the object is a person or group of people, then "kicked out" can imply bias based on context.

The veterans club kicked out everyone who lacked an honorable discharge.
Joey was kicked out of the community meeting for incessant arguing and interrupting the recognized speaker.

 

[Adesh]

What's the context for your question?

Understanding whether "kicked out" is derogatory depends on context and the object.

Situation is that a man with authority is expelling someone of lower rank.

 

[Klystron]

Situation is that a man with authority is expelling someone of lower rank.

In that case the informal expression "kicked out" or more formal "expelled" might indicate bias or even imply ulterior motives from the authority figure depending on the situation. The term "kicked out" in this context suggests personal violence.

In my computer examples "kicked out" implies an energetic action lacking animus.

 

[Adesh]

The term "kicked out" in this context suggests personal violence.

Yes. It’s a shame on civilised society if a man with authority uses such a term for someone who disagree with him on some issues.

Would you like to elaborate :-) ?

 

[Ibix]

Situation is that a man with authority is expelling someone of lower rank.

And says "I'm kicking you out"? I might or might not be offended by being kicked out (it'd depend on what I'd done and whether I thought he had a good reason), but not really by it being described as "kicked out".

Maybe if there's a culture of formal speech wherever you are, informal speech might be considered rude in that context.

 

[Adesh]

it'd depend on what I'd done and whether I thought he had a good reason

Reason given in formal letter is “Whining” and I don’t know what does that mean? If you complain something to the authority, does it count as whining?

 

[Klystron]

The term "kicked out" in this context suggests personal violence.

Yes. It’s a shame on civilised society if a man with authority uses such a term for someone who disagree with him on some issues.

Would you like to elaborate :-) ?

If we take the term "kicked out" or "thrown out" literally, it describes actual physical violence. For example there are films of fascist political rallies circa 1930's where suspected communists were beaten and literally kicked out of the meeting because of their appearance, clothing or a pamphlet they carried.

Even more shocking given evolving societal standards, one can see people -- particularly reporters -- physically manhandled and forced out of modern public political events at the behest of the speaker. Almost always the physical actions are carried out by supporters, never directly by the authority figure.

 

[Adesh]

If we take the term "kicked out" or "thrown out" literally, it describes actual physical violence. For example there are films of fascist political rallies circa 1930's where suspected communists were literally beaten and kicked out of the meeting because of their appearance, clothing or a pamphlet they carried.

Even more shocking given evolving societal standards, one can see people -- particularly reporters -- physically manhandled and forced out of public political events at the behest of the speaker. Almost always the physical actions are carried out by supporters, never directly by the authority figure.

I think the term stemmed from there only, to kick out somebody is to mean that security guards has kicked him out of the room, literally. So, saying someone “You’re kicked out from this...” is very insulting.

 

[Vanadium 50]

It sounds like your complaint is with the action, not the description.

 

[hmmm27]

In common usage it's an informal phrase that just means "cause to leave", implying that the kicker has authority to do so :

A tavern manager kicks everybody out at closing time ;​

​

A bylaw officer or cop kicks a group of kids out of the skateboard park because the facility's closed, due to the coronavirus.​

In the above two examples, the kicker might actually choose to say "Okay, I'm going to have to kick you out", rather than a more formal "We hereby demand that you leave the premises" sort of thing, which is just askin' fer a smack upside the head. It all depends on how you want to wield your authority.

It's pretty lightweight ; any derogation would be in mannerisms or delivery.

 

[WWGD]

Situation is that a man with authority is expelling someone of lower rank.

That by itself does not say whether it was justified or not.

 

[Ibix]

Reason given in formal letter is “Whining” and I don’t know what does that mean? If you complain something to the authority, does it count as whining?

So he kicked you out of something for whining? Whining is that annoying "but daddyyyyyy you saiiid I could have an ice creaaaam daddyyyy, you diiiid!" tone of voice you get from young kids complaining about the injustice of something. Complaining to authority might be characterised as whining by someone who felt that the complaint was groundless. I would see that term as disrespectful. I might well think that you were whining about something and I might even say it to friends, but I certainly wouldn't put it in writing. Not in anything like a professional situation.

It does rather sound like there's a personality clash going on here, besides whether or not whatever complaint you made is justified.

 

[jrmichler]

In my mind, the examples of "kicked out" given above range from normal action (kicked out a list) to firm action (kicked out of meeting). I did not see anything derogatory or insulting in the examples. That said, higher management is normally receptive to a complaint the first time, but not to hearing the same complaint more than once. Or a series of minor complaints from the same person.

When a manager takes the time to write a "shape up" letter, the unwritten subtext is "or start job hunting because you are on thin ice". Even if the manager is wrong, you lose.

 

[berkeman]

https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.tow...5cae40/580a41d3d6620.image.jpg?resize=400,281

 

[Adesh]

It sounds like your complaint is with the action, not the description.

:-) It’s with both. Action and description both but description made the action even worse.

When I get warnings here, the notice that I get from @fresh_42 is so nice, respectful and gentle that it makes their action more respectable. But some other authorities act like as if we are on streets.

 

[Adesh]

That by itself does not say whether it was justified or not.

Situation “kicking out” arises just because the member/employee was disagree with higher authoritative man on a issue brought up by the member/employee regarding the unjust action of another, new member.

 

[Adesh]

Complaining to authority might be characterised as whining by someone who felt that the complaint was groundless. I would see that term as disrespectful. I might well think that you were whining about something and I might even say it to friends, but I certainly wouldn't put it in writing. Not in anything like a professional situation.

Yes, authority shouldn’t behave like street gang leader . You see putting those words in professional reasoning column is a sign of something...

And it must also be natural that a man who is member/employee for 1 and half years won’t make a groundless complain.

 

[Adesh]

In my mind, the examples of "kicked out" given above range from normal action (kicked out a list) to firm action (kicked out of meeting). I did not see anything derogatory or insulting in the examples. That said, higher management is normally receptive to a complaint the first time, but not to hearing the same complaint more than once. Or a series of minor complaints from the same person.

When a manager takes the time to write a "shape up" letter, the unwritten subtext is "or start job hunting because you are on thin ice". Even if the manager is wrong, you lose.

Yes, that’s how the “normal” authority functions, “normal” means those kinds of authority who consider themselves “even higher than US government” . And in most of cases a civil, respectful member won’t make unnecessary complain, after they are authority and we work under them, no problem. They can act the way they like but they cannot insult someone.

 

[symbolipoint]

Situation is that a man with authority is expelling someone of lower rank.

That description is in slightly better terminology, terminated. Maybe, "ejected" could work, too.

 

[Adesh]

That description is in slightly better terminology, terminated. Maybe, "ejected" could work, too.

Yes, ejected would have been better.

 

[etotheipi]

Yes, ejected would have been better.

Ejected seems like what you say when you press the big red button on the dashboard of your car and get launched into up into the air with a parachute. Happens to me all the time...

 

[Adesh]

Ejected reminds me of an excerpt from Much Obliged, Jeeves by P.G. Wodehouse :
Jeeves and Bertie were talking about the situation in Aunt Dahlia's house, after hearing Jeeves Bertie exclaimed

'Good Lord' I ejaculated, if ejaculated is the word I want.

 

[OCR]

Happens to me all the time...

Only happened once for this guy. . . .

.

 

[Adesh]

I think people with some power tend to behave as to make others feel that they (power holders) are superior to them (other people).

 

[gmax137]

Isn’t “kicked out” a derogatory term?

No.

 

[Adesh]

No.

It can be subjective :-)

 

[jbriggs444]

It can be subjective :-)

If one asks a question and then refuses to accept a direct answer, it suggests that the question was not sincere.

 

[gmax137]

In my mind, there are problems enough in the world without manufacturing offense where none is intended.

 

[Adesh]

If one asks a question and then refuses to accept a direct answer, it suggests that the question was not sincere.

I thought this was a discussion (as my tags say) so people can have different opinions and at the same time having a respect for other's opinion.

However, as you always help me in Classical Physics sub-forum, I cannot argue with you as you're my teacher.

 

[Adesh]

In my mind, there are problems enough in the world without manufacturing offense where none is intended.

Thats really a great line.

 

[jbriggs444]

I thought this was a discussion (as my tags say) so people can have different opinions and at the same time having a respect for other's opinion.

I am trying to remain as civil as I can. The original question might be charitably interpreted as "help me understand the connotations of this phrase".

The impression conveyed since then is something more akin to "please support my feeling that a wrong has been done in this situation which I have not fully described".

 

[Adesh]

The impression that is conveyed since then is something more akin to "please support my feeling that a wrong has been done in this situation which I have not described".

Even if it seemed that I was asking for support then also I don't think I aimed something wrong and as far as description of the situation is concerned, he will suspend me if I describe the whole situation here.

 

[Rive]

personally find “kicked out” a very derogatory and insulting remark

Depends on the context. It is kind of legendary and a good reason to brag about being kicked out from (the bush around) a women's bath for peeking

Reason given in formal letter is “Whining” and I don’t know what does that mean?

That place sounds like not as good as a bath to brag about, but still, you are still free to be happy about leaving it