Let a and b denote 2 2d vectors

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    2d Vectors
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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around proving the inequality involving two 2D vectors, specifically showing that the dot product of the vectors is less than or equal to the product of their magnitudes. The participants are exploring the properties of vector operations and inequalities in the context of linear algebra.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss starting points for the problem, including computing the dot product and magnitudes of the vectors. There is a focus on algebraic manipulation and the validity of the steps taken in the calculations. Questions arise regarding the correctness of formulas and the implications of squaring terms.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants actively engaging in algebraic manipulation and questioning the validity of their reasoning. Some have provided guidance on how to approach the inequality, while others are still clarifying their understanding of the mathematical concepts involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating through algebraic errors and misunderstandings regarding vector magnitudes and the properties of inequalities. There is an emphasis on ensuring correct algebraic steps and understanding the implications of each manipulation.

  • #31
ibaforsale said:
oh okay, so i get

2 <= (a12b22 + a22b12) / a1b1a2b2

or if i move everything i get

0 <= a12b22 + a22b12 - 2a1b1a2b2

OK. Only the second expression has everything on the right side. So now you have to figure out why that is ##\ge 0##.
 
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  • #32
ibaforsale said:
oh okay, so i get

2 <= (a12b22 + a22b12) / a1b1a2b2
The above won't do you any good.
ibaforsale said:
or if i move everything i get

0 <= a12b22 + a22b12 - 2a1b1a2b2

Or more suggestively, 0 <= a12b22 - 2a1b1a2b2 + a22b12

There's something you need to do with this...
 
  • #33
LCKurtz said:
OK. Only the second expression has everything on the right side. So now you have to figure out why that is ##\ge 0##.

is it greater than 0 because the squared terms will always be greater?
 
  • #34
ibaforsale said:
is it greater than 0 because the squared terms will always be greater?

How do you know that? Are you just guessing?
 
  • #35
my thinking is that squaring something will always be bigger than multiplying by 2
 
  • #36
First, the things you are squaring aren't the same as the things you are multiplying by two, and secondly, (1/2)2 < 2*(1/2) so the basic logic there doesn't work.

You need to do some algebra to re-write the right hand side.
 
  • #37
Squaring ##1## isn't bigger than multiplying it by ##2##. Look, you need to do some algebraic manipulation with that expression to make it obvious that is is ##\ge 0##. We have led you by the hand to this point and I don't see how we can give you that last step without having worked the whole problem for you.

As a matter of curiosity, what course are you in and what courses have you already had?
 
  • #38
i was thinking the algebra might include taking out common terms but there are none, can i get a hint as to what needs to happen
 
  • #39
LCKurtz said:
We have led you by the hand to this point and I don't see how we can give you that last step without having worked the whole problem for you.
That's how I feel as well.
 

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