Limits dealing with indeterminate forms

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the evaluation of limits involving indeterminate forms, specifically the subtraction of two limits that both approach infinity. Participants explore whether the expression formed by subtracting these limits can be manipulated or simplified.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the limit lim_{x\rightarrow 0}(cos(x)/x) subtracted from lim_{x\rightarrow \infty}(x) results in an indeterminate form of infinity minus infinity.
  • Another participant asserts that the difference between the two limits is undefined and that writing an expression for their difference is grammatically incorrect.
  • A participant questions the validity of manipulating the expression lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x - lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x into lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} (x - x), seeking clarification on this point.
  • Responses confirm that such manipulation is not valid, reinforcing the idea that the difference does not exist.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the expression involving the subtraction of the two limits is undefined, but there is a lack of consensus on the manipulation of the limits and the implications of indeterminate forms.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the handling of limits that approach infinity and the implications of indeterminate forms, highlighting the complexity of limit manipulation.

dwaonng
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Suppose you have one limit

[tex] lim_{x\rightarrow \ 0}(cos(x)/x) = \infty[/tex]

and a second limit

[tex] lim_{x\rightarrow \ \infty}(x) = \infty[/tex]

What is the first limit subtracted by the second? Is it simply indeterminate because its inf - inf?

One friend suggested I assume x=cos(y)/y for the second limit then change the second limit to look as follows:

[tex] lim_{x\rightarrow \ \infty}(x) =? lim_{y\rightarrow \ 0}(cos(y)/y)[/tex]

Then can I say:
[tex]lim_{x\rightarrow \ 0}(cos(x)/x) - lim_{y\rightarrow \ 0}(cos(y)/y) =? 0[/tex] ?
 
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dwaonng said:
What is the first limit subtracted by the second? Is it simply indeterminate because its inf - inf?
I assume you are specifically asking for the difference in the values of the two limits? That difference is undefined. In particular, writing an expression denoting their difference is grammatically incorrect.

If you were trying to solve a problem and arrived at this expression, you (probably) have encountered an indeterminate form. If the problem is simply about this difference, then the answer is that the difference is undefined.


Just to make sure my point is clear, even this expression:

[tex]\left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right) - \left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right)[/tex]

is undefined; the difference does not exist, and it would be incorrect to assert this difference is zero.
 
So you are saying that I can't manipulate the following:[tex]\left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right) - \left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right)[/tex]

into say...

[tex]\left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x - x \right)[/tex] ?

is that correct?
 
dwaonng said:
So you are saying that I can't manipulate the following:


[tex]\left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right) - \left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x \right)[/tex]

into say...

[tex]\left( \lim_{x \rightarrow +\infty} x - x \right)[/tex] ?

is that correct?
Correct.
 

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