Mathematics of tensor products in the Bell states

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the mathematics of tensor products as applied to Bell states in quantum mechanics. Participants explore the expansion of tensor products, the interpretation of notation, and the nature of entangled states. The conversation includes technical reasoning and conceptual clarifications related to the representation of quantum states.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about expanding tensor products in the context of Bell states and questions whether the states are one-dimensional.
  • Another participant asserts that there is no need to expand tensor products, stating that the notation |00⟩ is equivalent to |0⟩_A ⊗ |0⟩_B.
  • A participant seeks clarification on whether tensor products can be expanded and how to determine when to interpret the notation as a tensor product versus another form.
  • It is noted that a vector can always be expanded in terms of a basis, but the choice of basis affects the representation of the tensor product.
  • One participant challenges the representation of tensor products as matrices, questioning the meaning of a specific 4 x 2 matrix and its relevance to the discussion.
  • Another participant explains that while the tensor product space consists of 4-D unit vectors, not every vector in this space is a simple tensor product of two vectors, highlighting the concept of entangled states.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the necessity and method of expanding tensor products. There are competing views on the interpretation of notation and the representation of quantum states, indicating that the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the notation and representation of quantum states, particularly in relation to tensor products and entanglement. The discussion reveals a dependence on definitions and the choice of basis for expanding vectors.

PerilousGourd
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I'm having trouble with the mathematics of tensor products as applied to Bell states.

Say I have the state
<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> \left|\psi\right&gt; &amp;= \frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left(\left|0\right&gt;_A \otimes \left|0\right&gt;_B + \left|1\right&gt;_A \otimes \left|1\right&gt;_B\right)<br /> \end{align*}<br />

How would the tensor products be expanded here? Are the states \left|0\right&gt;_A etc one dimensional?

I'd usually expand tensor products like

<br /> \left|\psi\right&gt; \otimes\left|\phi\right&gt; = \left(\matrix{\psi_1\\\psi_2}\right) \otimes \left(\matrix{\phi_1\\\phi_2}\right) = \left(\matrix{\psi_1\phi_1\\\psi_1\phi_2\\\psi_2\phi_1\\\psi_2\phi_2}\right)<br />

In this case, is it just

\left|0\right&gt;_A \otimes\left|0\right&gt;_B = \left(\matrix{0_A0_B}\right) ?

And \left(0_A0_B\right) is equivalent to \left|00\right&gt; and so on by convention of notation (this makes me slightly uncomfortable; can any scalar be denoted a ket?), so that the original state can be written

<br /> \begin{align*}<br /> \left|\psi\right&gt; &amp;= \frac{1}{\sqrt{2}} \left(\left|00\right&gt; + \left|11\right&gt;\right)<br /> \end{align*}<br />

Was my working here correct? Or is there some funky \left|0\right&gt; = \left(\matrix{1\\0}\right) business going on, like I've seen in places?
 
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There's no reason to expand the tensor products. They are basis elements of the tensor product space obtained by treating A and B as a single system. The notation ##|00\rangle## is just a different way of writing the same thing as ##|0\rangle{}_A\otimes |0\rangle{}_B##.
I have not seen the notation ##(0_A0_B)## before. Either it's just another form of notation for the same thing (in which case it's a ket, not a scalar), or else it's not equal to either of the other two.
 
Thank you for your reply!

andrewkirk said:
There's no reason to expand the tensor products.

No reason to, or it actually can't be done? If it can be done, I'd love to see the process, as it would help with my intuition a lot.

How can you tell when \otimes should be interpreted as a tensor product to be expanded and when it should be interpreted another way?

If \left|0\right&gt; = \left(\matrix{1\\0}\right) (where physically this represents light polarized in the horizontal direction), how do you know when to continue as
<br /> \left|0\right&gt; \otimes \left|0\right&gt; = \left(\matrix{1\\0} \right) \otimes \left(\matrix{1\\0}\right) = \left(\matrix{1&amp;1\\1&amp;0\\0&amp;1\\0&amp;0}\right)<br />
which is surely not the same as \left|00\right&gt;, and when to continue as
<br /> \left|0\right&gt; \otimes \left|0\right&gt; = \left|00\right&gt;<br />
?

The 0_A0_B notation before meant nothing unusual and was bad labelling on my part, sorry.
 
PerilousGourd said:
No reason to, or it actually can't be done? If it can be done, I'd love to see the process, as it would help with my intuition a lot.
A vector can always be expanded in terms of a basis. A vector whose expansion is a single term in one basis will typically have a multi-term expansion in another basis. Say ##|\psi\rangle## is a basis ket for basis ##B##, and ##B'## is a different basis. Then we can expand that in the ##B'## basis as:

$$|\psi\rangle=\sum_{\phi\in B'}|\phi\rangle\langle\phi|\psi\rangle$$

How can you tell when \otimes should be interpreted as a tensor product to be expanded and when it should be interpreted another way?
It's always a tensor product. Whether we want to expand it in a particular basis depends on whether we think that might help us towards our computational goal.

<br /> \left(\matrix{1\\0} \right) \otimes \left(\matrix{1\\0}\right) = \left(\matrix{1&amp;1\\1&amp;0\\0&amp;1\\0&amp;0}\right)<br />
I'm afraid I don't know what this equality is meant to signify, as I don't know what is meant by the 4 x 2 matrix on the RHS. The space that is the tensor product of two 2D vector spaces is a 4D vector space, so its elements can be represented as 4-vectors or 2 x 2 matrices - eg ##\left(\matrix{1\\0\\1\\0}\right)## or ##\left(\matrix{1&1\\0&0}\right)##. But I can't see any natural way to represent them as 4 x 2 matrices without redundancy.
 
The tensor product of two 2-D unit vectors can be represented as a 4-D unit vector as you indicated where ψ1ϕ1 is regular multiplication.
The tensor product space is all 4-D unit vectors. However not every member of the tensor product space is the tensor product of two vectors, e.g. the superposition 1/√2(|00⟩+|11⟩) = 1/√2[1,0,0,1]. Such vectors (states) are said to be entangled.
 

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