Not sure about this coordinate definition

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    Coordinate Definition
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation and interpretation of Eddington-Finkelstein coordinates in Schwarzschild spacetime, particularly focusing on the role of the integration constant in defining these coordinates. Participants explore the implications of using a constant to define a coordinate and the nature of the family of null geodesics represented by the equations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how a constant of integration can be used to define a coordinate, suggesting that coordinates are typically not constants.
  • Another participant clarifies that the constant represents a continuous parameter that selects a specific geodesic from a family of null geodesics, implying that it can indeed be treated as a coordinate.
  • A subsequent reply raises concerns about potential redundancy in the parametrization of the space due to the introduction of this continuous parameter, hinting at issues of parametrization invariance.
  • Another participant simplifies the discussion by stating that choosing a different time parameter does not complicate the situation, asserting that all geodesics follow the same spatial path but start at different times.
  • A later reply expresses understanding after the clarification, indicating that the explanation has resolved their confusion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the role and implications of the integration constant in defining coordinates, with some seeing it as a potential source of confusion while others view it as a straightforward parameterization. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of parametrization invariance.

Contextual Notes

Participants do not reach a consensus on the necessity or implications of using the integration constant as a coordinate, leaving open questions about the nature of the parametrization.

TrickyDicky
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In the derivation of the Eddington-Finkelstein coordinates in Schwarzschild spacetime we started with the worldline of a radially ingoing photon:
[tex]ct=-r-2mln(\frac{r}{2m}-1)+C[/tex]
where C is a constant of integration since we got this from integrating the dt/dr with negative
sign from the Schwarzschild radially moving photon.
The next step to introduce the new Finkelstein coordinate (wich would be the advanced time v) is to use the integration constant given in the photon worldline to define this new coordinate that allows us to say that 2m=r is not a real singularity.
[tex]v=ct+r+2mln(\frac{r}{2m}-1)[/tex]
What I don't see clearly in this step is how come we use a constant to define a coordinate, I would have thought a coordinate is not usually a constant, it can be momentarily for certain purposes like when we hold one of the coordinates fixed to see what happens, like examining a constant time hypersurface, or when we take advantage of some symmetry like spherical symmetry to hold constant phi and theta coordinates. But I just don't see why would we want to keep the advanced time E-F coordinate constant.
Anyone has a clue about this?
 
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TrickyDicky said:
In the derivation of the Eddington-Finkelstein coordinates in Schwarzschild spacetime we started with the worldline of a radially ingoing photon:
[tex]ct=-r-2m \ln (\frac{r}{2m}-1)+C[/tex]
where C is a constant of integration since we got this from integrating the dt/dr with negative
sign from the Schwarzschild radially moving photon.

This equation defines a whole family of null geodesics. C is a continuous parameter that selects which geodesic out of that family we are talking about. So we can define a coordinate system in which C is one of the coordinates.
 
Ben Niehoff said:
This equation defines a whole family of null geodesics. C is a continuous parameter that selects which geodesic out of that family we are talking about. So we can define a coordinate system in which C is one of the coordinates.
Thanks Ben, is there not a redundancy in the parametrization of this space by introducing this continuous parameter? perhaps parametrization invariance here poses a problem?
 
Not sure what you're talking about. You seem to be reading way too much into things and confusing yourself.

It's really quite simple. Let me re-write the geodesic like so:

[tex]t - t_0 =-r-2m \ln (\frac{r}{2m}-1)[/tex]

So, all we are doing is choosing a different t_0. All these geodesics follow the same path in 3-space, but start at different times. That's all there is to it.

Now we just define [itex]v = t_0[/itex]. Simple.
 
Ben Niehoff said:
Not sure what you're talking about. You seem to be reading way too much into things and confusing yourself.

It's really quite simple. Let me re-write the geodesic like so:

[tex]t - t_0 =-r-2m \ln (\frac{r}{2m}-1)[/tex]

So, all we are doing is choosing a different t_0. All these geodesics follow the same path in 3-space, but start at different times. That's all there is to it.

Now we just define [itex]v = t_0[/itex]. Simple.

Ok, it's clear now, thanks.
 

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