Oh boy where to begin...
Infinitarian said:
Actually, for most of its history the worst thing the Church did was excommunication, which is the same thing you're doing right now.
I find it pathetic and utterly repugnant that mass persecution over a long period is being compared to having rules on an Internet forum. You are denigrating the suffering and struggle of countless people when you make such melodramatic and crass comments.
Infinitarian said:
Saying "you can always go to another forum" is like saying "you can always go to another religion,"
No it's like saying you're welcome to join our club so long as you abide by the rules. Nothing strange about that. It's one of the most normal attributes of human social groupings! You don't just seem to be arguing against the rules we have but against rules in general.
Infinitarian said:
because anyone dominant enough to run a forum is dominant enough to abuse their position.
Nonsense. Having the necessary time, skills and dedication automatically must mean you harbour megalomaniac tendencies? That's a spurious generalisation that is nothing more than a poor attempt at arguing that we can't have rules because what's to stop the rule makers doing what they like! Well in this forum what will stop us is that if we do abuse our positions then the forum will loose members, fast. Ironically this would be the same as if we relaxed the rules as they are what allows us to, uniquely amongst science forums, keep the signal to noise ratio high.
Infinitarian said:
You do not own this forum any more than the thousands of people who joined this forum before the censorship rules were even instituted.
Actually Greg owns it. He made it and it's his private property. As for "censorship" this forum has always had rules but has evolved to have better rules and enforcement more suited to what the members want. If you hadn't have already said you're leaving (and why people join to complain before leaving again is beyond me) I'd advise you to read through old threads and discussions from times when there were "theory development" and "independent research" forums which lacked rules as strict as those applied to other forums. You'll see that there were a lot of complaints because for every good idea there was there were hundreds of uninformed crackpots and weeding out all the bad took a lot of effort. If it was that simple to run an Internet forum with lax rules and still have a high standard of quality you can bet your bottom dollar that we, and every other forum out there, would be doing it.
At the end of the day we are content that we won't be able to say that a grand new theory was developed here because that's not what we are for. Ultimately our aim is to teach and discuss mainstream science to help laypeople understand and to help researchers at all stages of their career so that they can go and develop and announce that grand new theory in the right places: a lab and in peer-reviewed literature.
Infinitarian said:
As it happens, this is also the largest forum on the net, and for advanced questions the only place where you're likely to get an answer. I already posted my question in half a dozen groups but no answer so far.
Just pausing on this for a second: did you not think to put two and two together and conclude that we're as good as we are thanks (in part) to the rules and moderators? Rather than in spite of them? This forum is full of intelligent, caring volunteers who admirably give their time to help others. Sure those thousands of people could probably debunk most crack pottery, help those with their own theories even if 99% of that help is explaining misunderstandings and even have a good academic discussion about a variety of topics currently banned. But they don't want to and they can't do what they want to do in an environment where those things are allowed because the site will become taken over by it.
Infinitarian said:
Not trying to change this forum, anymore than I am trying to change the world in a blog post, just venting before I leave.
To me it seems you're a conflicted person with some perspective and anger issues. Conflicted because you seem to feel the need to clarify you're not trying to achieve anything and yet you've put so much energy in telling us how bad we are at what we do (even though you acknowledge we do a great job...). The issues come in the vehemence of what you've written and the odd focus you've chosen. You berate our rules without showing any acknowledgment that you've considered why they are there and what discussions have gone on in the past to lead to them. From what you've written it seems your perception of us is one of dictators who have risen in an idyllic community, seized power and started a regime of censorship and abuse when nothing cold be further from the truth. If you do come back and read this I really hope you stop and think and next time you feel the need to "vent before you leave" perhaps start by discussing things politely first rather than running screaming for the door, insulting everyone of your war. You'll find it makes for a more productive experience.
Infinitarian said:
I have no more need of this forum and banning me will be purely symbolical. But the symbol will be in my favor, because I did not break any rules except to post a question about global warming.
If you had read the rules you would have known that's against the rules and that it's not a bannable offence.
Infinitarian said:
People who flame are people who plan to be banned, and think that they might as well make it worth it. You provoke flaming. I was tempted to do it myself, but I'll get my point across better anyway if I don't.
Your point is flawed because you've taken no time to discuss, interact and ultimately learn from this community why it is the way it is. The fact that flaming was a consideration for you shows me how lazy you are and how content you are to wallow in your own bias. Reiterating what I've posted above it would be far more beneficial for you and others if you adopted an open approach rather than blindly labelling everyone as dictators and reaffirming your belief in how the world works. Honestly if you can't separate a private forum's rules with systematic social oppression then you need to see a professional.
Infinitarian said:
So my suggestion to the moderators is this: stand down. This forum would be better of without you, and the less of you there are to the better. You're useless to this forum and your position as moderators is just a way to make you feel better about yourself. People could just block people like on Facebook, or vote to hide their posts as on Youtube. This is my last post on a forum ever. The groups on Facebook are much smaller, but they'll have to do. They'll grow. I'm not the only one who's had enough of forums.
I've said all I needed to say in response to this. The only thing I feel like adding is that ill step down as moderator when I can no longer commit or when the other mentors and members of this forum think that I should. And aside from ill thought out "vents" like this I've seen nothing to indicate the latter, rather we frequently receive praise for the work we do here in giving the members space to make a great forum.
