Osmotic Pressure: Why It's Not Bad Physics

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of osmotic pressure, specifically addressing the origins of this pressure in relation to solute and solvent interactions across a semi-permeable membrane. Participants explore theoretical interpretations and clarify misconceptions about the role of solute and solvent in generating osmotic pressure.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines osmotic pressure as the pressure difference between two solutions of different solute concentrations separated by a semi-permeable membrane.
  • Another participant questions the completeness of a quoted statement regarding osmotic pressure and suggests that further explanation is needed.
  • A participant shares a visual representation to illustrate their understanding of osmotic pressure and seeks validation of their interpretation.
  • Some participants argue that osmotic pressure cannot be attributed solely to the solute, emphasizing the necessity of the solvent's presence in generating osmotic pressure.
  • It is proposed that osmotic pressure arises from the partial pressures of the solvent molecules, with the solute molecules remaining on one side of the membrane, thus creating a pressure difference.
  • One participant explains that once equilibrium is reached, the pressure on one side consists solely of the solvent, while the other side includes both solvent and solute, leading to a net pressure towards the dilute side.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the role of solute versus solvent in generating osmotic pressure. There is no consensus on whether it is appropriate to attribute osmotic pressure solely to the solute.

Contextual Notes

Some statements rely on specific interpretations of osmotic pressure and may depend on definitions of terms like "pressure" and "equilibrium." The discussion does not resolve these nuances.

iScience
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osmotic pressure is the pressure difference between two solutions of different solute concentrations separated by a semi-permeable membrane.

my book says: "the osmotic presssure is exactly the same as the pressure of an ideal gas of the same concentration as the solute. in fact, it's tempting to think of the osmotic pressure as being exerted entirely by the solute, once we have balanced the pressure of the solvent on both sides. This interpretation is bad physics."

why is it incorrect to say that the osmotic pressure comes from the solute?? fundamentally, at the site of the SP membrane, the solvent can pass through and the solute cannot, and the osmotic pressure is essentially the difference in the partial pressures exerted by the solvent molecules on each side. This difference comes from the fact that not all of the molecules hitting the SP membrane are the solvent molecules, some of them are the solute molecules which cannot pass through. So I don't see how it's bad physics to say that the solute is what's exerting the osmotic pressure (the pressure difference)

Thanks
 
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This cries for a next phrase with an explanation, is it really the whole related quote?
 
i think it would be easier to illustrate the context with a picture.

http://i.imgur.com/BIr3TgK.jpg

(the paragraph that starts with "figure 5.78")

based on your response, I'm guessing that i do have the right idea of osmotic pressure and i am not misguided about where it comes from?
 
There won't be the osmotic pressure without a solvent, so it is not solute only that matters.
 
Last edited:
Osmotic pressure is only pressure resulting from partial pressures. People tend to treat osmosis as something a bit 'magic but there's no extra force from anywhere. The 'small molecules' of the solvent will spread out into the whole of a container but the larger molecules will stay 'inside' the membrane. Once equilibrium is reached, you will have the pressure of just the solvent on one side but the pressures of the solvent plus the solute on the other side of the membrane. Hence the membrane experiences a net pressure towards the dilute side. There will be solvent on both sides - it will find its way into the solute, eventually, by diffusion.
 

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