Photon Interaction: Possible or Not?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the possibility of direct interactions between photons, exploring concepts from quantum mechanics and quantum field theory. Participants examine the implications of photon behavior in various contexts, including interference patterns and the role of fermion loops in photon interactions.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that photons do not interact directly, citing the unique points they occupy in spacetime.
  • Others mention that photon-photon interactions are mediated by fermion loops, which complicates the notion of direct interaction.
  • There is a distinction made between interference and interaction, with some arguing that interference does not imply direct interaction between photons.
  • Participants discuss the implications of quantum field theory, suggesting that photons can fluctuate into particle-antiparticle pairs, potentially altering classical electromagnetism.
  • Some contributions highlight the Hong-Ou-Mandel effect as a specific instance of photon behavior at a beamsplitter.
  • There are claims that coherence in laser light does not equate to interaction, as interference can occur without direct photon interaction.
  • Discussions include the definition of interaction in terms of energy or momentum exchange, with some arguing that this does not occur with photons directly.
  • Participants question the validity of two photons being in phase, with references to coherent states in quantum optics.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally disagree on the nature of photon interactions, with multiple competing views presented. While some assert that direct interaction is not possible, others propose that indirect interactions via fermion loops are relevant. The distinction between interference and interaction remains a point of contention.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reflects varying interpretations of quantum mechanics and quantum field theory, particularly regarding the definitions and implications of interaction and interference. There are unresolved questions about the nature of photon behavior in different contexts.

  • #31
In QED they can. The lowest order Feynman diagram corresponding to this interaction is:

attachment.php?attachmentid=25899&stc=1&d=1274399802.png


Since these diagrams have the 4 vertices, the transition amplitude corresponding to these diagrams is of the order O(\alpha^{2}), where \alpha \equiv k e^{2}/\hbar c \approx \frac{1}{137} is the fine structure constant.
 

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  • #32
tom.stoer said:
1) there is no wave function for a photon (and no Schrödinger equation)

I thought Maxwell's equations describe the evolution of the wavefunction of a photon.
 
  • #33
There is also the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primakoff_effect" , which has interesting consequences if axions exist. You then have an effective photon-photon-axion vertex. In the presence of a strong magnetic field, a photon can then oscillate into an axion and vice versa.

This can be used to send http://arxiv.org/abs/0704.0490" .
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #34
Do photons emit from electrons instantly. It would suggest that photons move at different vectors relative to the electrons position in the atoms configuration. These photons travel at constant velocities so the possibility of two photons interacting traveling at the same vector;

• Given there is no obstacles to diffract or refract the photons course and;
• Given its vector isn’t distorted by gravity.
Cannot interact.

But this does not say that photons do not interact.
In its state/function i would think it wouldn’t inherit changes but that’s not to say they can’t occupy the same point in space. From a receprical point they do interact being they can have opposite Bearings. That is of course if electrons don’t emit photons instantly. TM
 
  • #35
I would suggest to stop the speculations and refer to QED.

Dickfore presented the lowest order Feynman diagrams that contribute to photon-photon scattering.

@Antiphon: Maxwell's equation are purely classical; in QED both the photon and the electron field are quantized; this results in quantum corrections like the diagrams Dickfore is referring to. According to Maxwell's equations photons do not interact directly, only via matter couplings. This carries over to QED: no direct interaction, only via Fermion loops.
 

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