Physics Graduate School in UK/Germany/Europe

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around obtaining a PhD in physics in the UK and Germany, focusing on funding, program structure, and differences between the educational systems in these regions compared to the US. Participants share insights and experiences regarding the application process, funding opportunities, and the requirements for pursuing a PhD in these countries.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses a desire to pursue a PhD in the UK or Germany and questions whether graduate school is free in these countries, comparing it to the funded PhD programs in the US.
  • Another participant provides links to scholarship information, suggesting that there are various funding options available but emphasizes the need to research thoroughly.
  • A participant contrasts the UK and US PhD systems, noting that UK PhDs typically require a master's degree beforehand and are shorter and more structured, while US PhDs involve coursework during the first year and allow for more flexibility in research focus.
  • It is mentioned that while PhDs are usually free in the UK and Germany, there can be unfunded positions that do not require tuition fees but may not provide a salary or scholarship.
  • Concerns are raised about the implications of pursuing an unfunded PhD, particularly in experimental fields, as it may indicate a lack of funding for the research group.
  • In Germany, it is noted that there are typically no fees or only negligible fees, and that teaching participation is often required, with potential earnings mentioned for half-time positions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that PhDs in the UK and Germany are often free or have minimal fees, but there is no consensus on the specifics of funding and program structures. Multiple competing views exist regarding the implications of unfunded positions and the differences in educational systems.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity of the UK system as it evolves towards a model similar to the US, with variations in requirements based on individual universities and programs. The discussion reflects uncertainty regarding the funding landscape and the conditions of PhD programs in these countries.

abilolado
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Hello all.
I had a few questions about obtaining a PhD in UK and/or Europe.
I am currently an Undergrad physics student from Brazil studying in the US, once I am done I will pursue my PhD in some other university, since my current one, unfortunally, does not have a Physics Grad program.
My dream is to be able to study in the UK or Germany (or somewhere in Europe really, but mainly UK or Germany).
However I could not find the answer as to a question. Is physics grad school free on those places?
I know that one is usually funded to study physics in grad school here in the US, and is ofted paied to do research. Making obtaining a PhD essentially free. Is it the same in the UK/Germany? I would only think that yes, given the long history those countries have with the study of physics, but I could find no sources that sould affirm it.
I am a 3.9 GPA student at SHSU - TX.
Thank you in advance!
 
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Here is some sample information on the subject :

http://www.swansea.ac.uk/postgraduate/scholarships/

http://www.swansea.ac.uk/international/students/fees-and-funding/brazil/

Note that there are lots of different pages with relevant information . You have to dig around on the site to get the complete picture .
 
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I am in the US but know people who did/are doing their PhDs in the UK and Germany.
The UK system it is quite different from the US. In the US you take courses during the PhD in the first year or so, but in the UK you need to get a master's before the PhD. All of your coursework is completed in the masters before you begin your PhD. The PhD's there are also shorter and more structured. In the US you apply to a department and indicate your research interests on your application. While people usually stay in their intended subfield, they are technically not bound to it and can switch later on. In the UK you apply to a specific group and are much more restricted because of that. You usually get funding for three or four years, which is how long they usually take to do the PhD over there. On the other hand physics PhDs in the US usually take five to six years. This may sound very long, but I have heard some professors in the UK like the US system better for that reason since they feel that three years is not enough for most students to become truly independent researchers.

I think the system is similar in Germany based on the people I know who have experience there.
 
The answer is that PhDs are usually free; but there are exceptions. You can sometimes find unfunded positions but this does NOT -usually- mean that you will be paying a fee to the university, it just means that you won't get any money from e.g. a scholarship (or salary, depending on the system). These positions are usually targeted towards students who e.g. have managed to get a scholarship from their home country to do a PhD abroad (typically China and some countries in the ME).

Personally I would be vary of doing an unfunded PhD; at least if it is experimental. The salary/scholarship for a PhD student is usually quite a small part of the cost of a project meaning if they are not able to pay you the group is probably not very well funded. However, there are -as always- exceptions (some grants won't allow you to pay students etc)

The system in the UK is really complicated at the moment since we are moving more and more towards a "US style" grad school systems with 4-year CDTs (centres for doctoral training) where the first year is coursework, but there are still 3-year positions available. For the former you do need to have a MSc, for the latter the university can in some instances make exceptions and allow you to start with "only" a BSc, but then you would they you would have to pass some MSc level courses as well during your first year(usually).
 
In Germany there are either no fees or at most negligible ones. Whether you will have to take some classes depends on the university. However, you will have to participate in teaching.
Usually, you will be offered a half-time position which corresponds in the first year to about 2100 Euros /month netto. However, this depends on your supervisor, who is still the most important choice you have to make.
As an example, here's the link to the phd programme of the TU of Munich:

https://www.ph.tum.de/academics/phd/
 

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