Possible explanation for kinetic energy

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of kinetic energy, specifically why it is expressed as half the square of velocity. Participants explore the relationship between work done on an object, force, displacement, and the resulting kinetic energy, incorporating calculus and integration into their reasoning.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question why kinetic energy is defined as half the square of velocity, suggesting that summing velocities might imply a different relationship.
  • One participant describes the work done on an object as a function of force and displacement, leading to the integration of velocity to derive kinetic energy, emphasizing the role of calculus.
  • Another participant notes that accelerating an object for a longer duration results in a greater distance traveled, illustrating the quadratic relationship between time and distance in motion.
  • There are requests for further clarification on calculus notation and integration, indicating some participants are not familiar with these concepts.
  • One participant provides a derivation of kinetic energy using the average velocity and the relationship between acceleration and displacement.
  • Another participant refers to the total energy imparted to the cart as kinetic energy, linking it back to the work done by the applied force.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various interpretations and approaches to understanding kinetic energy, with no clear consensus on the foundational reasoning behind its definition. Some agree on the derivation methods while others seek clarification on specific mathematical concepts.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty regarding calculus notation and integration, which may limit their understanding of the derivations presented. The discussion includes multiple perspectives on the relationship between work, force, and kinetic energy without resolving these differences.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in the foundational concepts of kinetic energy, the relationship between work and energy, and those looking to understand the mathematical derivations involved in these physics principles.

physdoc
Messages
59
Reaction score
0
why does kinetic energy depend on half the square?
if we add up all the velocities does it not produce half a square?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
physdoc said:
why does kinetic energy depend on half the square?
if we add up all the velocities does it not produce half a square?

imagine you are pushing a cart and produce a rate of change of displacement i.e. velocity and somebody says you have given K.E. to the cart by pushing through a force F.
now the work being done by you is F.dx if dx is displacement and F is related to change in velocity/momentum - so the energy input
you provided is m.dv/dt . dx for a small time dt involving displacement.
this can be written as m.dv/dx. dx/dt .dx so summing up for all such displacement = m.v.dv integrated from v=0 to v=v and that's the energy .with a factor of 1/2.m. v^2
 
drvrm said:
imagine you are pushing a cart and produce a rate of change of displacement i.e. velocity and somebody says you have given K.E. to the cart by pushing through a force F.
now the work being done by you is F.dx if dx is displacement and F is related to change in velocity/momentum - so the energy input
you provided is m.dv/dt . dx for a small time dt involving displacement.
this can be written as m.dv/dx. dx/dt .dx so summing up for all such displacement = m.v.dv integrated from v=0 to v=v and that's the energy .with a factor of 1/2.m. v^2
Please explain further ...I am not familiar with the mechanics of calculus notation.
 
If you accelerate something at 1m/s/s for two seconds, it goes 4x as far as if you accelerate it for one second. 22=4
 
Thanks... That is another way to derive it.
 
physdoc said:
Please explain further ...I am not familiar with the mechanics of calculus notation.

when one integrates expression like integral of v.dv the result is v^2/2. people not knowing the integration will sum the values from 0 to v and w
 
So this is the same as what I said?
 
what do you mean when you say w
 
physdoc said:
why does kinetic energy depend on half the square?

The work done on an object to move it a distance x in the direction of the force applied is Fx. F = ma and a = (v-u)/t ; we also know that x = 1/2 (u+v) t since this is just the average velocity multiplied by time.

Work done = energy transferred = kinetic energy gained. This is m(v-u)/t * 1/2 (u+v)t = 1/2 m (v^2 - u^2). The kinetic energy is defined as the energy due to motion compared to when the object is at rest, so u = 0.

Therefore, KE = 1/2mv^2
 
  • #10
w i referred to the total energy imparted to the cart -which is K.E.-work done by the 'push force' which is responsible for the 'motion' the work done is a check on K.E. value. i.e. 1/2. m. v^2
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 15 ·
Replies
15
Views
3K
  • · Replies 41 ·
2
Replies
41
Views
4K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
3K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K