Problems with propagation of error

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    Error Propagation
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the propagation of error in calculations involving various mathematical operations such as multiplication, division, addition, subtraction, and powers. Participants seek clarification on their approaches to solving problems related to error propagation, particularly in the context of multiple variables.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses uncertainty about their attempts at error propagation and requests clarification on their correctness.
  • Another participant suggests reviewing the calculation of error propagation, emphasizing the neglect of constant values in formulas when deriving the error propagation formula.
  • A specific error propagation formula is provided for the equation \(D=-\frac{L}{4m}\), indicating that the constant \(-\frac{1}{4}\) is not significant in the error propagation context.
  • There are conflicting statements regarding the use of square and square root in error propagation, with one participant suggesting they cancel out and should not be used unless multiple variables are involved.
  • Another participant notes the need to transfer a minus sign in one of the expressions, indicating a potential oversight in the calculations presented.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the correct approach to error propagation, as there are multiple competing views regarding the treatment of constants and the use of square and square root in the calculations.

Contextual Notes

Some participants highlight that the error propagation formula may depend on the specific context of the problems being addressed, and there are unresolved aspects regarding the assumptions made in the calculations.

bobey
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bobey said:
I have problem regarding the propagation of error since the equations involving mixtures of multiplication, division, addition, subtraction, and powers. Please help me to clarify whether my attempts are right or wrong.

https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/333https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/334
https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/332View attachment 331

Hi bobey, :)

I think you should review how to calculate the propagation of errors. One of the basic things that you should remember is to neglect the constant values of the formulas when deriving the error propagation formula. For example take your Question 1.

\[D=-\frac{L}{4m}\]

Now, the error propagation formula would be,

\[\frac{\Delta D}{D}=\sqrt{\left(\frac{\Delta L}{L}\right)^2+\left(\frac{\Delta m}{m}\right)^2}\]

Even if you have the formula, \(\displaystyle D=\frac{L}{m}\) you get the same error propagation formula above. The constant \(-\frac{1}{4}\) have no significance.

Read http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~scphys/nsta/error_propagation.pdf and this to find out how to derive the error propagation for any given formula.

Kind Regards,
Sudharaka.
 
Last edited:
Sudharaka said:
Hi bobey, :)

I think you should review how to calculate the propagation of errors. One of the basic things that you should remember is to neglect the constant values of the formulas when deriving the error propagation formula. For example take your Question 1.

\[D=-\frac{L}{4m}\]

Now, the error propagation formula would be,

\[\frac{\Delta D}{D}=\sqrt{\frac{\Delta L}{L}+\frac{\Delta m}{m}}\]

I would check this if I were you.

CB
 
Problems with propagation of error for multiple variables

please help by telling me whether my approach to solve the problems are right or wrong. please refer to the ATTACHMENT for the questions and my approaches...

your help is highly appreciated!

question 1
View attachment 336
question 2
View attachment 337
 

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Re: Problems with propagation of error for multiple variables

bobey said:
please help by telling me whether my approach to solve the problems are right or wrong. please refer to the ATTACHMENT for the questions and my approaches...

your help is highly appreciated!

question 1
View attachment 336

For this one you should not need the square and square root, they cancel, and anyway you only use a root sum of squares composition of errors when there is more than one variable involved.

CB
 
Re: Problems with propagation of error for multiple variables

bobey said:
please help by telling me whether my approach to solve the problems are right or wrong. please refer to the ATTACHMENT for the questions and my approaches...

your help is highly appreciated!

question 1
View attachment 336
question 2
View attachment 337

For the second the same comment as for the first, otherwise OK (except you should transfer the minus sign attached to the 2 to the whole expression.

CB
 

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