Producing 100HZ Signal: A Story of Challenges and Creative Solutions

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the challenges faced by an electromotor serviceman attempting to produce a 100Hz signal using a modified 50Hz generator. The conversation explores the theoretical and practical aspects of generating the desired frequency, including modifications to the generator's windings and the implications of electromagnetic laws.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that to achieve a 100Hz output, the winding count must be doubled, which may not be feasible due to slot limitations.
  • Another participant suggests that simply modifying the stator is insufficient and proposes that increasing the shaft speed could be a straightforward solution.
  • A participant discusses electromagnetic laws, asserting that the magnetic flux must adhere to certain mathematical properties, indicating that generating even harmonics like 100Hz is impossible under the current setup.
  • There is a correction regarding the mathematical representation of magnetic flux functions, emphasizing the odd function characteristics and symmetry in core construction.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the feasibility of achieving a 100Hz signal through the proposed modifications. There is no consensus on the best approach or the reasons for the serviceman's failure to produce the desired frequency.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes unresolved assumptions about the generator's design limitations and the mathematical implications of electromagnetic theory, which may affect the conclusions drawn by participants.

m.s.j
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One electromotor serviceman who worked in a small workshop needed an ac power supply with 100HZ frequency.
He knew that in synchronous generator, if the magnetic flux of the field system is distributed perfectly sinusoidal around the air gap, then e.m.f generated in each full-pitched armature coil will be sinusoidal completely.
He had an old and small 50HZ generator. He decided to use it for 100HZ signal producing.
For this purpose, he changed standard distributed windings of armature that located in stator slots. Also he connected one electronically mid-pass filter which tuned with 100HZ frequency in generator output.
The output voltage of generator was not sinusoidal and it is distorted by new space flux distortion. He had a lot of harmonics in output stage of generator, but he never observed 100HZ signal in filter output.
He more and more tried and changed the stator winding distribution frequently, but he couldn't to produce purposed signal.

Why? Why couldn't he?


BEST REGARDS
MSJ


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Creative thinking is enjoyable,Then think about your surrounding things and other thought products. http://electrical-riddles.com
 
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Since this question is on the riddles link, I'll guess it isn't homework.

While multipole design is not a strong point a couple things come to mind.
1) You need to double the winding count. It seems improbable that there would be enough slots.
2) You can't change just the stator as the question states.

3) The simple solution would have been to double the shaft speed.
 
According to electromagnetic laws, the curl of electrical field (E) must be zero, for the circulation is zero, and the curl of magnetic field (H) is not zero, however; its circulation per unit area is the current density by Ampere's circuital law.Therefor in all magnetic systems, if some magnetic flux lines export from a surface of one volume of space, then same flux lines import to that volume via its other surfaces.
It means, for mathematic function of magnetic flux we can write: f(-x) = f(x) that named odd function.
Also according to Fourier analysis, each periodical odd function can be written with the sum of odd harmonic elements. So the serviceman can never produce even harmonic flux ( 100HZ,200HZ,…) in generator gap.


BEST REGARDS
MSJ


-----------------------------------------------------------------
Creative thinking is enjoyable,Then think about your surrounding things and other thought products. http://electrical-riddles.com
 
m.s.j said:
It means, for mathematic function of magnetic flux we can write: f(-x) = f(x) that named odd function.

That sentence shall be corrected as follows:
It means, for mathematic function of magnetic flux we can write: f(-x) = - f(x) that named odd function. Also because of core symmetrical construction, the flux function can be written by f ( x ) = f ( L – x ) where 2L is the function period.

REGARDS
MSJ
 

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