Proving Convergence and Finding Limit of Recursive Sequence

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving the convergence of a recursively defined sequence and finding its limit. The sequence is defined with initial terms and a recursive relation for \( n \geq 4 \). Participants explore methods to establish convergence, including bounding and monotonicity, as well as the implications of the recursive definition on the limit.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the sequence and proposes that to prove convergence, it is necessary to show that the sequence is bounded above and increasing.
  • Another participant questions the term "equilibrium point" and suggests it might be referred to as a stable point.
  • Some participants propose using induction to show that the sequence is bounded and monotonic, indicating that if the limit exists, it must satisfy the equation \( x = \sqrt{3 + x} \).
  • One participant outlines a method to show that \( x_n < 3 \) and suggests assuming \( x_n < 3 \) to demonstrate that \( x_{n+1} < 3 \) as well.
  • Another participant provides a series of inequalities to illustrate the relationships between terms in the sequence, but expresses uncertainty about how to proceed with the proof.
  • There is a claim that \( x_n \) is positive for all \( n \) and that \( x_{n+1} > x_n \) for all \( n \), indicating a potential increasing nature of the sequence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need to show that the sequence is bounded and monotonic to establish convergence, but there is no consensus on the specific methods or definitions used, particularly regarding the term "equilibrium point." The discussion remains unresolved as participants explore different approaches and clarify concepts.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the definitions of terms like "stable point" and "equilibrium point." The proof methods discussed rely on assumptions about the behavior of the sequence, which may not be fully established. There are also unresolved mathematical steps in the proposed proofs.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students or individuals interested in recursive sequences, convergence proofs, and mathematical reasoning in the context of sequences and limits.

Caeder
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Given the following sequence:

x_0 = 1, \quad x_1 = \sqrt{3+1}, \quad x_2 = \sqrt{3+\sqrt{4}}, \quad x_3 = \sqrt{3+\sqrt{5}},
x_4 = \sqrt{3+\sqrt{3+\sqrt{5}}}, \quad x_5 = \sqrt{3+\sqrt{3+\sqrt{3+\sqrt{5}}}} \ldots

prove the above sequence converges and determine the limit.

......

So from n=3 onwards, I notice that the sequence is recursively defined:

n \geq 4,\;x_n = \sqrt {3 + x_{n - 1} }

To prove convergence, I'd stimply have to show sequence is bounded above and that it's increasing.

I'm not quite sure how to do this with a recursive function.

To find the limit, I realized that

x_n = \sqrt {3 + x_{n - 1} } is at it's "equilibrium point" when x = 3 + \sqrt{x}. I solved for \sqrt{x} and found the limit to be:

\frac{1\pm\sqrt{13}}{2}. I then see that we go towards:

\frac{1+\sqrt{13}}{2}

So I know the limit will be the above if the sequence converges.

Any help on the proof?
 
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what you call "equilibrium point"?
 
al-mahed said:
what you call "equilibrium point"?

Stable point..
 
i'm not sure what a stable or equilibrium point is. You can show the sequence is bounded and monotonic using induction, show that it's bounded first, this will help you show it's monotonic.

This means lim x_{n-1} = lim x_n exists. The recursive definition and limit laws show that the limit, call it, x must satisfy the equation:

x=squareroot(3+x) or the quadratic
x^2-x-3, solve and deduce which solution is x.
 
SiddharthM said:
i'm not sure what a stable or equilibrium point is. You can show the sequence is bounded and monotonic using induction, show that it's bounded first, this will help you show it's monotonic.

This means lim x_{n-1} = lim x_n exists. The recursive definition and limit laws show that the limit, call it, x must satisfy the equation:

x=squareroot(3+x) or the quadratic
x^2-x-3, solve and deduce which solution is x.

I already know the limit. I'm having a hard time with the proof.
 
Caeder said:
I already know the limit. I'm having a hard time with the proof.

I gave you the outline of a rigorous proof.
 
\begin{array}{l}<br /> x_2 &lt; x_3 &lt; 9 \\ <br /> \sqrt {x_2 } &lt; \sqrt {x_3 } &lt; 3 \\ <br /> 3 + \sqrt {x_2 } &lt; 3 + \sqrt {x_3 } &lt; 6 \\ <br /> \underbrace {\sqrt {3 + \sqrt {x_2 } } }_{x_3 } &lt; \underbrace {\sqrt {3 + \sqrt {x_3 } } }_{x_4 } &lt; \sqrt 6 \\ <br /> x_3 &lt; x_4 &lt; 9 \\ <br /> \end{array}

Now I show it from the k+1 term? Not exactly sure how. But does that look right?
 
show x_3 is less than 3, then assume x_n is less than 3. what can you say then?

x_{n+1}=root(3+x_n)<root(3+3)<root(3+6)=3

done, so know x_n is bounded, now show it is monotonic.
 
x_n is positive for all n = {0,1,2,3,...}

x_{n + 1} = \sqrt {3 + x_n} ==> x_{n + 1} &gt; x_n for all n
 

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