Proving f = 0 almost everywhere

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem in Measure & Integration, specifically concerning the properties of a real-valued integrable function defined on the unit square [0, 1]^2. The original poster seeks to prove that if the integral of the function over any rectangle within this domain is zero, then the function must be zero almost everywhere.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the implications of the integral being zero over rectangles and question whether a non-zero function can yield a zero integral. There is discussion about partitioning sets where the function is positive and negative, and how this relates to the overall integral.

Discussion Status

Some participants have offered hints and suggestions for approaching the proof, including the use of contradiction and the Fubini Theorem. There is an ongoing exploration of the conditions under which the integral can remain zero despite the function being non-zero on a set of positive measure.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the challenge of proving the statement under the constraints of Lebesgue integration, as opposed to Riemann integration, and the need to consider the behavior of the function across all rectangles in the domain.

A.Magnus
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I am working on a problem##^{(1)}## in Measure & Integration (chapter on Product Measures) like this:

Suppose that ##f## is real-valued and integrable with respect to 2-dimensional Lebesgue measure on ##[0, 1]^2## and also

##\int_{0}^{a} \int_{0}^{b} f(x, y) dy dx = 0##
for all ##a, b \in [0, 1].## Show that ##f = 0## almost everywhere.
Here are what I only know of this problem:

(1) The mapping is ##f : [0, 1] \times [0, 1] \longrightarrow \Bbb R##

(2) Since we need to prove ##f = 0## a.e., and borrowing from set builder of convergence a.e., I think I need to prove this:

##\mu (\{ (x, y) \in [0, 1]^2 \mid f(x, y) \neq 0\}) = 0.##

Since this problem is under chapter on Product Measures involving iterated integral, I suspect I need to use the Fubini Theorem, but I do not know how to do it. Any hints or helps would be very much appreciated. Thank you very much for your time and effort.______________________________________________________________________________

(1) Richard F. Bass' http://homepages.uconn.edu/~rib02005/real-analysis-04nov2011.pdf 2nd. edition, chapter 11: Product Measure, Exercise 11.6, page 88.
 
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Assume that f is non-zero on a set that is not measure zero. Can you have the integral be zero? (yes) However, you can partition that set into the set where f is positive and the set where f is negative. It is impossible for the integral to be zero over both sets.
Apply that same rationale to your argument with the limits of integration a and b.
 
RUber said:
Assume that f is non-zero on a set that is not measure zero. Can you have the integral be zero? (yes) However, you can partition that set into the set where f is positive and the set where f is negative. It is impossible for the integral to be zero over both sets.
Apply that same rationale to your argument with the limits of integration a and b.

Thank you to RUber for your speedy response. Allow me though to ask you one question:

Am I in the right direction on (2)? In other words, are you giving me the hints above within the framework of ##\mu (\{(x, y) \in [0, 1]^2 \mid f(x, y) \neq 0 \}) = 0##?

Thank you again for your time and effort.
 
That's right. I propose proof by contradiction.
 
To add a bit to RUber's idea, illustrating, assume you have a small square s * (with sides parallel to the x-axis an y-axis respectfully) with measure>0 ,where ## f \neq 0 ## , and so that ##f == 1## in the left half and ## f == -1## on the right half. Remember that for simple functions f with values ##c_i##: ,## \int f = \int (\Sigma c_i \ chi_{c_i} ) = \Sigma \ c_i m( x: f(x)=c_i) ## . Now remember that the integral must be zero over _all_ partitions.

* Just to illustrate; obviously this set does not have to be a square; it doesn't even have to contain a square of measure >0..
 
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RUber said:
That's right. I propose proof by contradiction.

WWGD said:
To add a bit to RUber's idea, illustrating, assume you have a small square s * (with sides parallel to the x-axis an y-axis respectfully) with measure>0 ,where ## f \neq 0 ## , and so that ##f == 1## in the left half and ## f == -1## on the right half. Remember that for simple functions f with values ##c_i##: ,## \int f = \int (\Sigma c_i \ chi_{c_i} ) = \Sigma \ c_i m( x: f(x)=c_i) ## . Now remember that the integral must be zero over _all_ partitions.

* Just to illustrate; obviously this set does not have to be a square; it doesn't even have to contain a square of measure >0..

Here are what I managed to come up after feedbacks from you two, but I am still lost after the first two steps:

(1) By way of contradiction, assume that ##f = 0## a.e. is not true, meaning that ##\mu (\{ (x, y) \in [0, 1]^2 \mid f(x, y) \neq 0\}) \neq 0.##
(2) Let ##A = \{ (x, y) \in [0, 1]^2 \mid f(x, y) \neq 0\} ##, that is ##f(A) \neq 0##
(3) ...
(4) ...

Any further hints would be very much appreciated. Thank you for your time.
 
Basically, look for a rectangle ## a \times b ## , for some specific values of ##a,b ## that will contain a subset of the set of measure non-zero where the positive part does not cancel out the negative part in the integral. You can use a rectangle for S and the characteristic function as a motivating example (ultimately using simple functions to approximate your measurable function may be necessary.) so that the rectangle ## [0,a] \times [0,b] ## intersects S at S' in such a way that ## \int_{S'} f \neq 0 ## , following up on RUber's idea. Remember that the integral of f is assumed to be 0 over _all_ rectangles ##[0,a] \times [0,b] ; 0<a,b<1 ##.
 
WWGD said:
Basically, look for a rectangle ## a \times b ## , for some specific values of ##a,b ## that will contain a subset of the set of measure non-zero where the positive part does not cancel out the negative part in the integral. You can use a rectangle for S and the characteristic function as a motivating example (ultimately using simple functions to approximate your measurable function may be necessary.) so that the rectangle ## [0,a] \times [0,b] ## intersects S at S' in such a way that ## \int_{S'} f \neq 0 ## , following up on RUber's idea. Remember that the integral of f is assumed to be 0 over _all_ rectangles ##[0,a] \times [0,b] ; 0<a,b<1 ##.

Did you people, WWGD and RUber actually solve this problem? I think it's a bit harder than you are thinking. You (A.Magnus) should easily be able to show given the premises that the integral over ANY rectangle in the domain is zero. This isn't a Riemann integral, it's a Lebesgue integral. You could imagine that you would start it a function that's 1 over half the domain and -1 over half the domain and then somehow scramble it up so EVERY rectangle contains a equal amount of 1 and -1. That's what you need to show is impossible. I think you need something like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebesgue_differentiation_theorem or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebesgue's_density_theorem.
 
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