Proving Gauss Law using a "bad" Gaussian surface

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SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on proving Gauss's Law using a cylindrical Gaussian surface perpendicular to an infinite charged wire. The participant attempts to calculate the electric flux through the cylinder using the equation $$\Phi=\int \frac{dq}{4\pi \varepsilon_0 r^2} \hat{r} \cdot d\vec{A}$$ and expresses challenges in evaluating the integrals analytically. The discussion emphasizes the need for clear definitions of the proof's objectives and the complexities involved in handling the flux through the cylinder's sides.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of Gauss's Law and its mathematical formulation
  • Familiarity with cylindrical coordinates and their application in electromagnetism
  • Knowledge of electric flux and its calculation methods
  • Basic proficiency in calculus, particularly in evaluating integrals
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the derivation of Gauss's Law in various geometries, including cylindrical and spherical surfaces
  • Learn techniques for evaluating complex integrals in electromagnetism
  • Explore the implications of choosing different Gaussian surfaces for electric field calculations
  • Research common pitfalls and challenges in applying Gauss's Law to non-standard geometries
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Students and educators in physics, particularly those studying electromagnetism, as well as researchers exploring advanced applications of Gauss's Law in various geometrical configurations.

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Homework Statement


What I basically want to do is to prove Gauss Law with a cylinder perpendicular to an infinite charged wire (I know I can do this simple, but I want to do it this way)
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This is what I have done so far:

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Homework Equations


$$\Phi=\int \frac{dq}{4\pi \varepsilon_0 r^2} \hat{r} \cdot d\vec{A}$$

The Attempt at a Solution


So $$d=\frac{z}{tan(\theta)}$$ and therefore $$r^2=z^2 cot^2(\theta)+z^2$$. Now the flux through the top of the cylinder is $$\Phi=\int \frac{\lambda dx}{4\pi \varepsilon_0[z^2(1+cot^2(\theta))]} \widehat{r} \cdot d\vec{A}$$ where
$$\vec{A}=(\rho d\rho d\phi)\hat{z}$$ and $$\hat{r}=\frac{\vec{r}}{|r|}$$
So:
$$\Phi=\int \frac{\lambda dx}{4\pi \varepsilon_0[z^2(1+cot^2(\theta))]^{\frac{3}{2}}} (dcos(\phi),dsin(\phi),z) \cdot (\rho d\rho d\phi)(0,0,\hat{z})$$
But I don't know how to proceed... Maybe I can use cosine law to find $$\rho$$?
 
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How do you plan to handle the flux through the sides of the cylinder?
Also: you need a clear statement of what, exactly, it is that you are proving.
 
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Simon Bridge said:
How do you plan to handle the flux through the sides of the cylinder?
Also: you need a clear statement of what, exactly, it is that you are proving.
Using the fact that $$d\vec{A}$$ is $$\rho d\rho d\phi \hat{\rho}$$. First, I want to calculate the flux in the bottom and top of the cylinder, and I expect it will be slightly similar in the case of the sides. What I want to prove is that this flux is equal to $$\frac{q}{\varepsilon_0}$$
 
OK good luck ... there is a reason people don't try this: it's very difficult.
It is not uncommon to end up with integrals that cannot be evaluated analytically.

The integral you are asking about needs limits ...

... and you still should make an explicit statement of what you want to prove.
Are you just rotating the standard gaussian surface for the hell of it or are you trying to find something out?
ie. why pick a cylinder in that orientation? Why not a spheroid or a cube? Why not have the line of charge pass through the cylinder at an arbitrary angle to the cylinder axis?
 
The book claims the answer is that all the magnitudes are the same because "the gravitational force on the penguin is the same". I'm having trouble understanding this. I thought the buoyant force was equal to the weight of the fluid displaced. Weight depends on mass which depends on density. Therefore, due to the differing densities the buoyant force will be different in each case? Is this incorrect?

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