Question about inertial and non inertial frames

In summary, Person A is not accelerating with respect to person B because there is no friction between them.
  • #1
parshyaa
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Suppose a person A is standing in a bus and bus is accelerating forward then when a person B standing outside observes A he see that A is accelerating in forward direction then there must be a force acting on him which is making him accelarating(because Newtons first law holds in Earth's frame) and he asks him hey A are you feeling a force
Then what will A reply to B?
Assume that he is standing on skates so that friction force is 0.
 
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  • #2
If the friction is zero he is not going to accelerate. Where would the force come from?
 
  • #3
Orodruin said:
If the friction is zero he is not going to accelerate. Where would the force come from?
This is the point
As bus is accelarting so as person A is accelarting with respect to B but person A is not feeling any force then Newtons first law is getting fail in inertial frame
I know something is wrong in my statement, so please point it to me
 
  • #4
parshyaa said:
Assume that he is standing on skates so that friction force is 0.
parshyaa said:
As bus is accelarting so as person A is accelarting with respect to B
How you have described it A is not accelerating wrt B. The bus is accelerating, but A is just rolling to the back of the bus. The bus’ acceleration is not magically transferred to A: no friction, no acceleration
 
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  • #5
Dale said:
How you have described it A is not accelerating wrt B. The bus is accelerating, but A is just rolling to the back of the bus. The bus’ acceleration is not magically transferred to A: no friction, no acceleration
Sorry i didn't understand the point
This is the point
As bus is accelarting so as person A is accelarting with respect to B but person A is not feeling any force then Newtons first law is getting fail in inertial frame
I know something is wrong in my statement, so please point it to me
I think something is wrong here
 
  • #6
parshyaa said:
Sorry i didn't understand the point
If there is no friction, then there is no force to accelerate A along with the bus. It is just that. A will not accelerate with the bus unless there is a force of friction.
 
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  • #7
parshyaa said:
Sorry i didn't understand the point
You have assumed that

1. The bus is accelerating.
2. Person A in the bus is accelerating with the bus.
3. Person A feels no force causing the acceleration.

At least one of those assumptions is wrong. Whenever I am on a bus that is accelerating, I feel a force and have to lean forward to maintain balance.

If person A is in the aisle, standing on skates, someone had better open the back door. Because he is going to slide out.
 
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  • #8
Orodruin said:
If there is no friction, then there is no force to accelerate A along with the bus. It is just that. A will not accelerate with the bus unless there is a force of friction.
Ohh sorry man
This answered my question
Actully i haven't studied the concept of friction so i was having some misconceptions with friction, sorry for this point less question
 
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  • #9
parshyaa said:
How Foolish question was this
Not foolish - just a process of getting some understanding. :smile:
 
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  • #10
Try a little experiment. Lay a sheet of paper on a table top, and put a ball on the paper. Quickly pull (accelerate) the paper horizontally. What happens to the ball? Does it move along with the paper, or does it keep the same position, rolling while the paper passes underneath it?

The result may not perfectly match either description, but which one comes closer?
 
  • #11
Have you ridden a bus? What happens if you aren't holding on anything and the bus moves forward?
 
  • #12
parshyaa said:
Suppose a person A is standing in a bus and bus is accelerating forward then when a person B standing outside observes A he see that A is accelerating in forward direction then there must be a force acting on him which is making him accelarating(because Newtons first law holds in Earth's frame) and he asks him hey A are you feeling a force
Then what will A reply to B?
Assume that he is standing on skates so that friction force is 0.

If there was no friction between A's foot and the bus, A would not have accelerated with respect to B. But from A's point of view, B is accelerating backward.
 
  • #13
Dipti said:
If there was no friction between A's foot and the bus, A would not have accelerated with respect to B. But from A's point of view, B is accelerating backward.
Yes, discussion is already over

:welcome:
 
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1. What is the difference between inertial and non-inertial frames of reference?

Inertial frames of reference are those in which Newton's laws of motion hold true, meaning that objects at rest will remain at rest and objects in motion will continue to move at a constant velocity unless acted upon by an external force. Non-inertial frames of reference, on the other hand, are accelerating or rotating frames in which Newton's laws do not hold true.

2. How do inertial and non-inertial frames affect the measurement of acceleration?

In inertial frames of reference, acceleration can be accurately measured using standard equations such as a = F/m. However, in non-inertial frames, the measured acceleration may differ from the actual acceleration due to the effects of fictitious forces, such as centrifugal and Coriolis forces.

3. How does the concept of inertia relate to inertial frames of reference?

Inertia is the tendency of an object to resist changes in its state of motion. In inertial frames, objects will maintain their current state of motion unless acted upon by an external force, as described by Newton's first law of motion.

4. Can a non-inertial frame be transformed into an inertial frame?

Yes, it is possible to transform a non-inertial frame into an inertial frame through the use of fictitious forces. These forces can be added to the equations of motion to cancel out the effects of non-inertial forces, resulting in an inertial frame of reference.

5. How does the concept of relativity relate to inertial and non-inertial frames?

The theory of relativity states that the laws of physics are the same for all observers in uniform motion. Inertial frames of reference are in accordance with this principle, while non-inertial frames may introduce discrepancies due to the effects of fictitious forces.

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