Lingusitics Random annoyance at modern colloquial language.

[Gokul43201]

My pet peeves are the following slang words. It's tolerable if you're joking around, but I actually see people using these words in serious discussions.

gonna
wanna
could of
would of

AAAAGHHHH!

I really don't understand the "could of", "would of", "should of" phenomenon. Is this now considered acceptable English ? I've only noticed it here on PF (as I don't visit any other forums) and I find it used by some members who use no other form of slang or colloquialism.

 

[Moonbear]

I think that autocorrect on word processing software is at least partially to blame for this, along with careless use of apostrphes (a pet peeve of my own) and minor mis-spellings. Open Word, type a simple paragraph with some deliberate mistakes and count how many you have to go back and correct yourself- I'd guess very few. I learned to type largely using MS word, and found myself using the shift key and the apostrophe key increasingly little, as there was not the need to, which meant when I began browsing forums and using MSN messenger, my typing was frankly quite terrible.

I turned auto-correct off. It was annoying. When I'm using standard abbreviations for hormones and brain regions, I need to mix capitals and lowercase letters in atypical orders, and it kept changing those to all lowercase on me. It also would get confusing when I'd automatically backspace to correct things like "teh" instead of "the" and the autocorrect was fighting me to do it itself. The only thing I let autocorrect do now is to change a few keystrokes into symbols so I don't have to keep mousing (am I allowed to use mouse as a verb?) to the menu to insert greek letters.

 

[Moonbear]

I really don't understand the "could of", "would of", "should of" phenomenon. Is this now considered acceptable English ? I've only noticed it here on PF (as I don't visit any other forums) and I find it used by some members who use no other form of slang or colloquialism.

That's actually and old and quite common mistake in writing. We say "would've" and they hear "would of." We can't blame the current generation for starting that one.

 

[ray b]

english, or should we now use "american english'',
is an alive, growing, mongrel, mess
that has roots in many different tongues
with bazaar rules that lack rhyme or reason

the kids on the net have invented a more usefull shorthand version
I feel no need to use 18th century formal english
and feel the teaching of it is a huge waste of time
and english majors the most useless form of life

 

[Zeteg]

Guys, this is much ado about bugger all. If the English language never changed we'd still be speaking in Medieval English or summink. I really look forward to the day when my kids say to me 'Dad, you are so SICK', and really mean it in a modern way.

Good luck. Children don't tell their parents they're cool... Well, maybe at young ages they do, I guess. Here's some tips, comming from me =)

- Don't ask about their day at school (You'll only get a "Good." or something, even if you do it).
- Don't ask why they're late, if they're a couple of hours late.
- Don't pester them to call whenever they reach their desired destination.
- Help them out when they're buying Christmas gifts for friends, especially if they've got someone they really like :)
- Give them some trust. I believe kids which don't have parental trust seem to go into bad stuff more often.
- Try and explore their interest of music. At the very least, don't tell them that it sucks.


As for the part about the old English, I wouldn't mind at all. I find it's a lot easier to project my voice in old English anyway. There seems to be a lot less sarcasm in old English. As my CALM teacher would say, "COMMUNICATION ROADBLOCK".

 

[Moonbear]

Good luck. Children don't tell their parents they're cool... Well, maybe at young ages they do, I guess. Here's some tips, comming from me =)

- Don't ask about their day at school (You'll only get a "Good." or something, even if you do it).
- Don't ask why they're late, if they're a couple of hours late.
- Don't pester them to call whenever they reach their desired destination.
- Help them out when they're buying Christmas gifts for friends, especially if they've got someone they really like :)
- Give them some trust. I believe kids which don't have parental trust seem to go into bad stuff more often.
- Try and explore their interest of music. At the very least, don't tell them that it sucks.

Oh, there's no winning on these things. If you don't ask about their day at school, or why they are late, or pester them about calling, they'll decide you don't love them and couldn't care less about what happens to them. If you offer to help them out buying presents for their friends, they'll get mad that you're interferring, and tell you to leave them alone.
The trust part you're right on, but it's a two way street; the kids have to earn trust and keep that trust as much as you should give it to them when they earn it.
If you show interest in their music, they'll be SOOO EMBARRASSED and will start seeking other music to listen to.

That's just what kids, especially teenagers, do, they get embarrassed and annoyed by anything their parents do.

 

[Zeteg]

Oh, there's no winning on these things. If you don't ask about their day at school, or why they are late, or pester them about calling, they'll decide you don't love them and couldn't care less about what happens to them. If you offer to help them out buying presents for their friends, they'll get mad that you're interferring, and tell you to leave them alone.
The trust part you're right on, but it's a two way street; the kids have to earn trust and keep that trust as much as you should give it to them when they earn it.
If you show interest in their music, they'll be SOOO EMBARRASSED and will start seeking other music to listen to.

That's just what kids, especially teenagers, do, they get embarrassed and annoyed by anything their parents do.

Oh come on, that's not true. I am a teenager :P
Maybe if you have a girl, she might decide that you don't love her. However, I really don't believe guys care that much, or would even draw those conclusions.

I meant give them money in buying presents :P

Teens don't care if you like their music, in fact, they certainly won't get embarrased. Well, not us Metal types anyway. My friend's dad loves metal, and we all think he's awesome :P

 

[Evo]

I really don't understand the "could of", "would of", "should of" phenomenon. Is this now considered acceptable English ? I've only noticed it here on PF (as I don't visit any other forums) and I find it used by some members who use no other form of slang or colloquialism.

Think about it. First they took "would have" and abbreviated it to "would've" and then spelled it phonetically (would've=would of).

edit:just noticed moonbear already said the same thing.

 

[Evo]

the kids on the net have invented a more usefull shorthand version
I feel no need to use 18th century formal english
and feel the teaching of it is a huge waste of time
and english majors the most useless form of life

There is a big difference between a language evolving and being mutilated by ignorance.

Ever try to read something written in middle or old English? Notice that there were no real rules? The same word was spelled many different ways? Do you see what a problem that became? That is why today we have "rules" that are standard, agreed upon ways to spell something correctly and structure a sentence correctly. It doesn't mean that there isn't going to be slang coming in and out of fashion each generation, or within ethnic groups, but as a whole, there has to be some consistency, and people need to know at least the basics. Unfortunately it seems too many can't even grasp the basics.

 

[Moonbear]

Teens don't care if you like their music, in fact, they certainly won't get embarrased. Well, not us Metal types anyway. My friend's dad loves metal, and we all think he's awesome :P

Does your friend agree about that? The other kids' parents are always cooler than your own.

Rest assured, all us adults were teenagers once too, and while your generation might talk funny , the rest of that list is nothing new. Even my parents complained about my grandparents doing the same thing. When I was your age, I said the same thing, and swore I'd never do those same things with my own children, and now I look back and realize, yep, my parents just might have known what they were doing and I'll probably do the same thing to my own kids when I get around to having them. (Gee, thanks for making me sound old and responsible now. This isn't going to help my campaign for funniest PFer. )

 

[jimmy p]

I hate it when people say "thingy" because they can't be bothered to use the proper term. Was it the thingy they mentioned a minute ago or a new thingy? At this point I usually switch off.

Ooh massive pet peeve! When people say "you know". No, I don't know. Explain. It seems common nowadays to say "you know" a lot in normal conversation and it bugs me very much so.

What else?? Hmmm when people insist on TyPiNg LiKe ThIs. GRRRRRRRRR! VeRy ChIlDiSh AnD iT mAkEs Me WaNt To HuRt PeOpLe WhEn I sEe ThIs.

How about when people say "and I goes to him [insert uninteresting crap here]". How can you go to someone? Don't they REALLY mean "and I said to him [insert more grammatically correct faeces here]".

 

[mattmns]

YeAh i HaTe ThAt StYlE oF tYpInG.

Another thing I dislike is this:

"So I says to her..."

The "says" part.

 

[Moonbear]

Uh oh! I know I'm guilty of "you know" a lot. I've cut it down a lot. It's an annoying habit I picked up from my mom. She has a really bad habit of always knowing more than everyone else and starting a lot of advice with, "You know what you could do..." (No mom, apparently I don't even though I thought I did.) Since I know it annoys me, it must be annoying when I use it too, so I try to catch myself, but still miss noticing at times.

 

[Evo]

I think that the "you know" is the type that's added at the end of every sentence. For example - I drove to the mall, you know. And there was this dress, you know. And it was, like, just what I wanted, you know. But, like, I didn't have enough money, you know. You have to throw "like" in there to get the full effect.

 

[recon]

From what I see above, the misuse of English in America is minor when compared to the misuse of English in Singapore/Malaysia/Brunei. This is an extract from a recent MSN Messenger conversation that I had with my friends:

Person 1: wah u look like loan shark liao...haha very garang like dat..eh bolo $50.
Person 2: $50 to him is nth lar, $500 more llike it.
Person 1: stupid...i need so much for wat? like u meh go thailand find those.
Person 2: yea lor, go thailand shopping need more than $500 le, wat find those stupid eke.

Translation:
Person 1: (talking to Person 3) Wow, you look like a loan shark because of that serious look on your face. Can I borrow $50?
Person 2: $50 is nothing to him. Ask for $500.
Person 1: Why would I need so much? It's not like I will be going to Thailand to find those ... (At this point, I have no idea what Person 1 is talking about)
Person 2: You need more than $500 if you want to go shopping in Thailand, especially if you want to find those...(At this point, I have no idea what Person 2 is talking about)

 

[Moonbear]

From what I see above, the misuse of English in America is minor when compared to the misuse of English in Singapore/Malaysia/Brunei. This is an extract from a recent MSN Messenger conversation that I had with my friends:

Person 1: wah u look like loan shark liao...haha very garang like dat..eh bolo $50.
Person 2: $50 to him is nth lar, $500 more llike it.
Person 1: stupid...i need so much for wat? like u meh go thailand find those.
Person 2: yea lor, go thailand shopping need more than $500 le, wat find those stupid eke.

Translation:
Person 1: (talking to Person 3) Wow, you look like a loan shark because of that serious look on your face. Can I borrow $50?
Person 2: $50 is nothing to him. Ask for $500.
Person 1: Why would I need so much? It's not like I will be going to Thailand to find those ... (At this point, I have no idea what Person 1 is talking about)
Person 2: You need more than $500 if you want to go shopping in Thailand, especially if you want to find those...(At this point, I have no idea what Person 2 is talking about)

I'm really glad you translated, because I might as well have been reading another language. I had no idea what that whole conversation was saying!

 

[Gokul43201]

So how high does the "...and I'm like...", "...and she's like..." lines (to be construed in the context of the stereotypical female teenager to female teenager conversation) rate on your annoyance scale ?

It's pretty high on mine.

 

[Evo]

From what I see above, the misuse of English in America is minor when compared to the misuse of English in Singapore/Malaysia/Brunei. This is an extract from a recent MSN Messenger conversation that I had with my friends:

I don't know how you could decipher that. recon, did you grow up in the US? Your English is perfect.

 

[Evo]

So how high does the "...and I'm like...", "...and she's like..." lines (to be construed in the context of the stereotypical female teenager to female teenager conversation) rate on your annoyance scale ?

It's pretty high on mine.

It's like, very high. On par only with "dude".

 

[Gokul43201]

On par only with "dude".

I love "dude", but really, that's one word (if it is a word) that is far more potent spoken than when written. Also, it really ticks off Ivan...and that's just so much fun

 

[Gokul43201]

...did you grow up in the US? Your English is perfect.

I formally offer my protest against this line of thinking. A person can feel insulted to be asked a question like that.

There are many well educated people in non-English speaking countries that have a far better grasp of the English language than the average American.

(psst, Recon...don't burst my bubble...please)

 

[Evo]

Also, it really ticks off Ivan...and that's just so much fun

I know someone who won't be getting any frozen broccoli in his stocking.

 

[Evo]

I formally offer my protest against this line of thinking. A person can feel insulted to be asked a question like that.

I am callous and unthinking.

There are many well educated people in non-English speaking countries that have a far better grasp of the English language than the average American.

Unfortunately, that's all too true. But she talks like an American, not British, there is a difference. Unusual for someone that hasn't lived here. Her (American) English sounds natural, not something you can usually pick up abroad, unless you are surrounded by native speakers.

 

[Mk]

I hate when people say anyways
I used to say anyways, then I worked with a girl who would say "Anyways? Anyways? Anyways?" everytime I said it. It was irritating, but now I say anyway.

Ha ha, I love to poke fun in it, and say "anywayses."

I turned auto-correct off. It was annoying. When I'm using standard abbreviations for hormones and brain regions, I need to mix capitals and lowercase letters in atypical orders, and it kept changing those to all lowercase on me. It also would get confusing when I'd automatically backspace to correct things like "teh" instead of "the" and the autocorrect was fighting me to do it itself. The only thing I let autocorrect do now is to change a few keystrokes into symbols so I don't have to keep mousing (am I allowed to use mouse as a verb?) to the menu to insert greek letters.

Yeah, I hate auto-correct, I never have it on, I mix abbreviations, capitals, and lowercases, and I end up backspacing to much because auto-delete does it, on top of me doing it.

the kids on the net have invented a more usefull shorthand version. I feel no need to use 18th century formal english
and feel the teaching of it is a huge waste of time
and english majors the most useless form of life

Well, biased and exaggerated, but kids have used a mutated form of enliglish, and lagauge is mutations of other ones usually, look at English now compared to 200 years ago, we've shorthanded a lot of stuff successfully, gotten rid of the "ye"'s and such. A big waste of time? I don't think so, you have to have difference between slang and formal-er types.

Good luck. Children don't tell their parents they're cool... Well, maybe at young ages they do, I guess. Here's some tips, comming from me =)

- Don't ask about their day at school (You'll only get a "Good." or something, even if you do it).
- Don't ask why they're late, if they're a couple of hours late.
- Don't pester them to call whenever they reach their desired destination.
- Help them out when they're buying Christmas gifts for friends, especially if they've got someone they really like :)
- Give them some trust. I believe kids which don't have parental trust seem to go into bad stuff more often.
- Try and explore their interest of music. At the very least, don't tell them that it sucks.

Ha, very true, I must be picked apart to tell what happened in school today. These points are very true, and good guidelines to follow. Definitley don't say a music type sucks. I'd say to help buy gifts. Girls jump to negative conclusions easily, not as much as guys, by a long shot.

The other kids' parents are always cooler than your own.

Ha, ha, that is sooo true.

 

[matthyaouw]

I think that the "you know" is the type that's added at the end of every sentence. For example - I drove to the mall, you know. And there was this dress, you know. And it was, like, just what I wanted, you know. But, like, I didn't have enough money, you know. You have to throw "like" in there to get the full effect.

It's often due to the mouth stalling for time when it's working faster than the brain. Not always, mind. It can just be force of habit- something you pick up from someone you spend a lot of time with. I must say I'm sometimes guilty of it.

Ever try to read something written in middle or old English? Notice that there were no real rules? The same word was spelled many different ways?

The most glaringly obvious thing when I read some of the stained old documents at work is that the letter F and the letter S seem to be entirely interchangable. Do you have any idea just how confusing that can be when I turn up to work after 3 hours sleep and a little too much beer?

 

[gerben]

what about many people (everyone?) here on physics forum not using whole English words but abbreviating them with an apostrophe, like in:

don't
it's (often confused with its)
I'd
I'm
I'll
we're
can't
could've (leading some to "could of")
wouldn't
haven't
etc.

Especially constructs like "didn't" are, I would think, more troublesome to type then "did not".

But what really annoys me is that Americans speak on television with beeps and write with *'s instead of letters, for example I do not know what Moonbear meant with: "Cold as a witch's t**." (in post #12)
I guess "t**" must mean something like vagina, ass or breast, but "t**" is not to be found in any Dutch-English dictionary.

 

[Moonbear]

Gerben, those contractions are not formal English, but they are standard English.

As for those words you can't find in a dictionary, that's why we use *s. People who know the slang words will know what we mean, and those who don't aren't being taught new words their parents would rather they not know. Since you asked, t** refers to a breast. I was referring to an often used colloquial expression, not making up something new. You might find it in a dictionary, but the definition will be a type of bird.

 

[gerben]

Gerben, those contractions are not formal English, but they are standard English.

Yes I know, I just personally find them "ugly" and I think it makes the language less clear.

As for those words you can't find in a dictionary, that's why we use *s. People who know the slang words will know what we mean, and those who don't aren't being taught new words their parents would rather they not know. Since you asked, t** refers to a breast. I was referring to an often used colloquial expression, not making up something new. You might find it in a dictionary, but the definition will be a type of bird.

It just generally annoys me that certain expressions are not allowed. Especially if it goes as far as people using the words being beeped out. I do now see what the "t word" was, there is also an 'i' and another 't' in it...

Here is an image of a blue t** (Parus caeruleus):

http://www.irishbirdimages.com/pages/trip_reports/feurt_photos/blue_tit.jpg

 

[mattmns]

So that is what a tit is. I always wondered what guys were talking about when they said some girl has some nice tits, and now I know.

 

[Moonbear]

So that is what a tit is. I always wondered what guys were talking about when they said some girl has some nice tits, and now I know.

Yep, they're very cute, aren't they?