The discussion revolves around the impressions of various candidates during a Republican debate, focusing on their performances, strategies, and public perceptions. Participants share their thoughts on individual candidates, including their strengths and weaknesses, while also reflecting on the overall tone of the debate.
Participants expressed a range of opinions about the candidates, with no clear consensus on who performed best. Disagreements were evident regarding individual candidates' strengths and weaknesses, particularly concerning Bachmann, Cain, and Romney.
Some participants noted the importance of candidates maintaining a low profile early in the primary season to avoid fatigue among voters. There were also discussions about the implications of candidates' statements and how they may be interpreted differently by various audiences.
Readers interested in political debates, candidate evaluations, and Republican primary dynamics may find this discussion relevant.
Char. Limit said:He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?
They're kind of, you know, the elite.
Char. Limit said:He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?
They're kind of, you know, the elite.
skippy1729 said:For me, an elitist is someone whose self-perceived image of their superiority oozes from every pore of their body. It has nothing to do with money. It is the "I am better and smarter than everyone else" attitude. I am not talking about confidence, I am talking about arrogance.
Skippy
No.Char. Limit said:He's the CEO of a corporation. How does he NOT come off as elitist to you?
No scholarship to elite private prep schools in Hawaii, no Ivy League. There is however one thing that strikes me as arrogant about the man, and only one: why can he not be bothered to run for some lower state or federal office first? Where did he draw the go-directly-to-the-Presidency card?Wiki said:Cain was born in Memphis, Tennessee, son of Luther Cain, Jr. and his wife Lenora Davis. His mother was a cleaning woman and his father, who was raised on a farm, was a chauffeur. He grew up in Georgia. Cain graduated from Morehouse College in 1967 with a Bachelor of Arts degree in mathematics, and received a Master of Science degree in computer science from Purdue University in 1971, when he was also working full-time in ballistics for the U.S. Department of the Navy. As a civilian ballistics analyst, he was responsible for developing fire control systems for ships and fighter planes.
mheslep said:why can he not be bothered to run for some lower state or federal office first? Where did he draw the go-directly-to-the-Presidency card?
Thanks, I missed that, which changes my opinion for the better.Vanadium 50 said:Hi did. He ran for senator and lost.
Proton Soup said:i'm really liking the alligator idea. in fact, i would go further and have sharks with laser beams patrolling the coasts.
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/10/06/334170/herman-cain-top-10/
if he won the nomination, i think the Reps would have to spend a lot of time coaching him.
WhoWee said:CNN commentators are tripping over one another trying to discredit Romney - only enforces my opinion of the best ticket - Romney/Gingrich 2012!
Proton Soup said:eh, i didn't watch the post-debate stuff. couldn't help but chuckle at how Perry is such a hothead, tho. Perry goin' down! and Romney... the man's a damn good liar, smiling the whole time.
i think i wouldn't mind seeing Paul with somebody like Gingrich. he's a bit of snake, but a damn smart one at least.
WhoWee said:I know what you meant - "electable" implies success in the general election. Accordingly, I'll restate my question with greater specificity - why do you think Cain is more electable than Romney in the general election against the current President (Obama)?
DoggerDan said:Since you're putting it that way, in the form of a hypothetical yet improbable (due to current two-party system rules) three-way election, I think the republican vote would simply be split between Romney and Cain, while the full measure of the Democrat vote would go to Obama.
On the other hand, let's assume Clinton and Obama both ran against Cain and Romney. Who might win then?
Haven't a clue.
Getting back to reality, I think it's important to work within the actual structure, and doing so, my original point stands in that I believe people need to determine what's most important to them. Is it the election of their candidate of choice? Or is it to ensure their party's candidate gets elected?
That's where things get complicated, and depending on one's goals, one's choice may be dependent on the candidates in the other party.
WhoWee said:Actually, I didn't intend to mean a 3 person race - a breakout candidate Cain running on the TEA Party or other ticket would split the vote.
I was asking who has a better chance of beating Obama head to head as the Republican candidate - Romney or Cain?
DoggerDan said:I think Cain. Several reports have confirmed Cain would capture the attention of the South, while Romney would not, yet Cain appeals to conservatives as much as Romney does.
BobG said:There's two different strategies for selecting a candidate:
1) Select the candidate perceived as most likely to win even if you don't think he'll pursue the objectives you really want them to.
2) Select the candidate that's most likely to accomplish your objectives and just hope.
Considering the way elections usually go, the second option isn't as bad a strategy as one might think.
The Consumer Confidence Index heavily influences how an election will go - especially the expectations index. The lowest expectations index for an incumbent (or a candidate from the same party as the incumbent) that won the Presidential election was Bush 43 with an expectations index of about 92. The highest for an incumbent (or a candidate from the same party as the incumbent) that lost the election was Gore with an expectations index of about 108.
Currently, the expectations index is about 52. Obama will never survive that kind of rating if it's still that low next fall no matter who his oponent is. Then again, that index can change rather rapidly. Just last summer, the expectations index was around 80 or so.
Expectations index depends heavily on the job outlook. The best strategy for Obama to recover is to push the unemployment rate down regardless of what it does to the economy. I think it's real doubtful he'll push that jobless rate down far enough get the expectations index anywhere close to the midrange (100 is considered midrange and neutral).
Given that, it's not a bad gamble to go for the candidate most appealing to conservatives and let the election go however it goes.
The best strategy for Obama to recover is to push the unemployment rate down regardless of what it does to the economy. I think it's real doubtful he'll push that jobless rate down far enough get the expectations index anywhere close to the midrange (100 is considered midrange and neutral).
skeptic2 said:The Republicans too appear to be keenly aware of the importance of the unemployment rate in Obama's reelection. Could that explain their opposition to everything that would reduce the unemployment rate? For instance, cutting spending will cause the loss of jobs in the short term whereas increased spending, while bad for the budget short term, will put more people to work immediately and increase tax revenues long term.
WhoWee said:Do you have a specific piece of legislation in mind?
BobG said:That would be the Obama jobs bill, and the broken up version of the jobs bill that Dems are trying to push through piece by piece.
Killing it could be a problem for Republican incumbent legislators next election, but Obama blaming the bill's failure on Republicans probably won't work in a Presidential election unless the Republican candidate is a Republican Congressman that personally voted to kill it (and then it would still be a hard sell, just because time erases a lot of things).
Running against a Republican governor that had nothing to do with killing the bill and the only thing that will matter is whether people have jobs or not - not who voted for or against a bill that may have or may not have improved unemployment rates if it had passed.
There are exceptions. Truman ran against a do-nothing Congress and won an upset victory. But there's never a guarantee that the underdog will lose - it's just a lot more likely that the underdog will lose.
BobG said:Running against a Republican governor that had nothing to do with killing the bill and the only thing that will matter is whether people have jobs or not - not who voted for or against a bill that may have or may not have improved unemployment rates if it had passed..
What Presidential election do you have in mind where the new President's party ever lost (net) seats in Congress at the same time?skeptic2 said:I agree. At this point in time it looks like Obama will lose but the Democrats will pick up a few seats in both houses.
mheslep said:What Presidential election do you have in mind where the new President's party ever lost (net) seats in Congress at the same time?
That would be the time with Gore winning the popular vote, but I still don't see it any pick up in either chamber. The House remained Republican, and if the Democrats picked up any seats it is in the single digits which I can't resolve here:Vanadium 50 said:Election of 2000.
skippy1729 said:... (cut spending,
Yes
No, they would all cut tax rates but also eliminate deductions in various ways so it takes some work to assess whether tax revenue goes up/downcut taxes,
No. Paul in particular opposes.seal the border,
Yesrepeal Obamacare)