Rotational mechanics, angular momentum revision

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The discussion focuses on a rotational mechanics problem involving angular momentum and kinetic energy. The initial and final moments of inertia are calculated, leading to the determination of the final angular velocity using conservation of angular momentum. A discrepancy arises regarding the conservation of kinetic energy, as the final kinetic energy is greater than the initial. It is clarified that the additional kinetic energy comes from the work done by the man to pull the dumbbells closer, indicating that mechanical energy is added to the system. This highlights that kinetic energy is not conserved in this scenario due to the internal work performed.
Nono713
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Homework Statement



The problem is attached as an image. Note this is from a past exam.

Homework Equations



Conservation of angular momentum.
Rotational kinetic energy.

The Attempt at a Solution



a) The moment of inertia of the man and stool is given as 3 kg m^2, and the dumbells can be considered point masses, so we can just add them all up:

I_\mathrm{initial} = I_\mathrm{man} + 2I_\mathrm{dumbell~~~ away} = 3 + 2(3 \times 1^2) = 9

I_\mathrm{final} = I_\mathrm{man} + 2I_\mathrm{dumbell ~~~pulled~~~ in} = 3 + 2(3 \times 0.25^2) = 3.375

b) The initial angular velocity of the man is 1.5, and its initial moment of inertia is 9, so the system's angular momentum is L = 1.5 \times 9 = 13.5. From conservation of angular momentum, the system must have the same angular momentum after the dumbells have been pulled in, so L = I_\mathrm{final} \omega_\mathrm{final}. So \omega_\mathrm{final} = \frac{L}{I_\mathrm{final}} = \frac{13.5}{3.375} = 4.

c) Using the rotational kinetic energy formula:

K_\mathrm{initial} = \frac{1}{2} I_\mathrm{initial} \omega^2_\mathrm{initial} = \frac{1}{2} \times 9 \times 1.5^2 = 10.125 J

K_\mathrm{final} = \frac{1}{2} I_\mathrm{final} \omega^2_\mathrm{final} = \frac{1}{2} \times 3.375 \times 4^2 = 27 J

I am note sure I got it right, shouldn't kinetic energy be conserved? Or does some of it go into potential energy because of the increased radius? I mean clearly the guy is going to spin faster, so the extra kinetic energy must be coming from somewhere.

PS: imagine the correct units are in there, I'm just too lazy to type them up in LaTeX :-p
 

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Nono713 said:
I am note sure I got it right, shouldn't kinetic energy be conserved? Or does some of it go into potential energy because of the increased radius? I mean clearly the guy is going to spin faster, so the extra kinetic energy must be coming from somewhere.
Your results look fine.

Where did the energy come from to move the dumbbells? :wink:
 
Does it come from the work done by the man to pull the dumbells in closer? (chemical energy stored in the man's muscles I suppose) - or maybe I'm overthinking it?
 
Nono713 said:
Does it come from the work done by the man to pull the dumbells in closer? (chemical energy stored in the man's muscles I suppose) - or maybe I'm overthinking it?
No, not overthinking; That's correct. So, since mechanical energy is being added by a system-internal source, the kinetic energy will not be conserved.
 
Right, that makes sense! Thanks a lot!
 
The book claims the answer is that all the magnitudes are the same because "the gravitational force on the penguin is the same". I'm having trouble understanding this. I thought the buoyant force was equal to the weight of the fluid displaced. Weight depends on mass which depends on density. Therefore, due to the differing densities the buoyant force will be different in each case? Is this incorrect?

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