Schrodinger's Equation validity for relativistic particles

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the validity of Schrödinger's equation for relativistic particles, exploring its limitations and the implications of Lorentz invariance. Participants examine whether there are additional mathematical or physical reasons for its inapplicability in relativistic contexts, as well as the relationship between Schrödinger's equation and other formulations like the Dirac and Klein-Gordon equations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that the lack of Lorentz invariance of Schrödinger's equation is a fundamental reason for its inapplicability to relativistic particles.
  • Others suggest that the general form of Schrödinger's equation is valid for all physical systems, but the specific form of the Hamiltonian determines its applicability.
  • A participant questions the relationship between the Dirac equation and the Klein-Gordon equation, noting that the latter is second-order in time and not obviously related to Schrödinger's equation.
  • There is a discussion about the Hamiltonian in quantum field theory (QFT) and how it differs from non-relativistic quantum mechanics, with some participants proposing that the Klein-Gordon equation is interpreted differently in QFT.
  • Participants express uncertainty about how to derive a well-defined Hamiltonian for the Klein-Gordon equation, given its second-order nature and lack of spin.
  • One participant presents a Hamiltonian density for the Klein-Gordon equation, discussing its transformation properties under Lorentz transformations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the validity of Schrödinger's equation for relativistic particles. Multiple competing views are presented regarding the implications of Lorentz invariance and the relationship between various equations in quantum mechanics and quantum field theory.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the assumptions underlying the Hamiltonian formulations and the implications of second-order equations in the context of quantum field theory. The discussion highlights the complexity of relating different theoretical frameworks without reaching definitive conclusions.

  • #31
This is a question involving the semantic on the statement

"The SE is not Lorentz invariant"

I'm trying to prove that the SE isn't Lorentz Invariant.

I think I've showed it. I'd just like some input on my argument.

Under the change of coordinates:

x^\mu \mapsto x'^{\mu}=\Lambda^\mu_{\phantom{1}\nu} x^\nu

Covariantly;

\partial_\mu \mapsto \partial_{'\mu}=\Lambda_\mu^{\phantom{1}\nu} \partial_{'\nu}

And the wavefunction;

\psi(x)\mapsto \psi'(x')=S(\Lambda)\psi(x)

where S(\Lambda) is just some linear function.

The SE:

\{\iota \hbar\partial_t+\frac{\hbar^2}{2\mu} \partial_\nu \partial_\nu \}\psi(x)=0

where \nu=1,2,3.

Trasforming \psi(x) \mapsto \psi'(x') and multiplying by S^{-1}(\Lambda), and transforming the partial derivatives, we get

\{\iota \hbar\Lambda_0^{\phantom{1}\nu} \partial_{'\nu}+\frac{\hbar^2}{2\mu} \sum^{3}_{i=1}\Lambda_i^{\phantom{1}\alpha}\Lambda_i^{\phantom{1}\beta}\partial_{'\alpha} \partial_{'\beta} \} \psi'(x')=0

On comparing this to the "primed" SE. We find that the conditions \Lambda must satisfy are

\Lambda_0^{\phantom{1}\nu} \partial_{'\nu}=\partial_{'0}

and

\sum^{3}_{i=1}\Lambda_i^{\phantom{1}\alpha}\Lambda_i^{\phantom{1}\beta}\partial_{'\alpha} \partial_{'\beta} = \partial_{'\nu} \partial_{'\nu}.

Now, my question is, for me to prove that the SE isn't Lorentz invariant, do I need to show

a) that no such \Lambda \in \mbox{O(1,3)} can exist

or

b) is it sufficient to pick some \Lambda' \in \mbox{O(1,3)} and show that it doesn't satisfy the above condition ("counterexample").

If b) is indeed sufficient, could someone explain why, as it would seem that the SE is Lorentz invariant for certain matrices \in \mbox{O(1,3)}, and what does this mean to the statement:

"The SE equation is not Lorentz invariant"

Thank you
 
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  • #32
Looking back on this question, I suppose I could cut out all the texing and just simply ask:

If I show that \exists a \Lambda \in O(1,3) which the Schrödinger Equation does not transform covariantly under, is this enough to say that the SE isn't Lorentz Covariant.

Because trivially, if I take the identity, it's going to work. And presumably others work. So certain transformations will work, but not all.

So my question is: is it sufficient to show a counterexample in O(1,3) (which I have) to make the "SE not Lorentz Covariant" statement.

Thank you
 

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