Schwarzschild Metric & Satellite Orbits: A Question

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the Schwarzschild metric and its application to circular orbits of a satellite around a large mass. Participants explore the relationship between different expressions of the metric and the implications for understanding satellite motion in curved spacetime.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes a circular orbit of a satellite with radius R and references the Schwarzschild metric, questioning the equivalence of two expressions for the spacetime interval.
  • Another participant provides equations for the derivatives of time and angle with respect to proper time, suggesting these may clarify the original question.
  • A third participant notes that stable orbits require the condition r > 6m, indicating a threshold for stability in the context of the Schwarzschild metric.
  • Another participant explains that the difference in notation regarding the spacetime interval is a matter of convention, emphasizing that ds² and dτ² can be interchangeable depending on the context.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of the metric and the relationship between the various expressions for the spacetime interval. There is no consensus on the resolution of the original question posed.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the importance of notation and the conditions for stable orbits, but the discussion remains open regarding the implications of these factors on the understanding of the Schwarzschild metric.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying general relativity, particularly in the context of orbital mechanics and the Schwarzschild solution.

TrueBlue1990
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Thanks in advance - this problem has been bothering me for a while!

I'm working with an unpowered spaceship orbiting a large mass M. The orbit is circular and it is following the geodesic freely. It has an orbit radies of r = R.

My question is this. The metric of the space-time curvature is the Schwarzschild metric:

ds^2 = - (1 - 2GM/(r*c^2) )*(c^2)dt^2 + [(1 - 2GM/(r*c^2) )^-1]*dr^2 + (r^2)dθ^2 + (r^2)*(sinθ^2)d∅^2 -(1)

But I keep seeing references to ds^2 = - (c^2)*d(tau)^2 -(2)

I understand the angular terms and dr disappear as the d(tau) means we are observing the orbit from the reference frame stationary with the satellite. But I can only how equation (1) = equation (2) in a Schwarzschild curved space if r (distance between mass and satellite) tends to infinity. But, in the case of the satellite's reference frame r=R.

I will be eternally grateful to anyone that can shed light on my error of understanding. Many thanks.
 
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I would like to answer but I have no idea what you mean. The circular orbit has

[tex]\frac{dt}{d\tau}=\frac{\sqrt{r}}{\sqrt{r-3\,m}},\ \ \frac{d\phi}{d\tau}=\frac{\sqrt{m}}{r\,\sqrt{r-3\,m}}[/tex] in case that helps.

Remember that the proper-length s in the metric is also cτ, so ds2= c22

[Edit]As Bill_K points out below this is true up to a sign, depending on the metric signature.
 
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Also r > 6m for orbits to be stable.
 
But I keep seeing references to ds^2 = - (c^2)*d(tau)^2
This is just a matter of notation. ds2 is called the spacetime interval. It's positive for a spacelike distance and negative for a timelike one. For a timelike interval it's more convenient to use in place of ds2 the proper time. So you pull out a minus sign, and pull out a factor of c2 to give it the right dimensions. Otherwise ds2 and dτ2 are interchangeable.
 

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