Second order differential equation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a second-order differential equation that participants are trying to solve using MATLAB Simulink. The equation involves terms related to angular motion and appears to describe a system akin to a pendulum. Participants seek clarification on the nature of the equation, initial conditions, and appropriate methods for numerical solution.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the equation and requests help in understanding its type for solving in Simulink.
  • Another participant confirms the equation as an ordinary differential equation (ODE) and inquires whether T is a constant and if initial conditions are provided.
  • A later reply specifies that T=10 and all initial conditions (x, x', θ, θ') are zero.
  • Participants discuss the implications of using Laplace transformation on the equation, questioning the feasibility of obtaining a closed-form solution due to mixed terms.
  • One participant suggests expressing the ODE as a system of first-order ODEs and using a Runge-Kutta numerical technique for solving it.
  • There is confusion regarding the treatment of x and x' in Simulink, particularly how to incorporate their initial conditions into the numerical solution process.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty about the application of Laplace transformation and whether a closed-form solution can be achieved. There is no consensus on the best approach to solve the ODE, with differing opinions on the use of numerical techniques and the handling of initial conditions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of the equation due to mixed terms and the necessity of transforming it into a system of first-order ODEs for numerical analysis. The discussion highlights the dependence on initial conditions and the potential challenges in applying certain mathematical techniques.

engnrshyckh
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i am given an equation which i have to solve in simulink. the equation is quite veered to me. some one help me in understanding what kind of equation it is so that i can solve it in MATLAB simulink.
(2+x^2)theta'' + (2xx' +1)theta' + 9.8(xcostheta-sinthetha)-x''=T
 
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engnrshyckh said:
i am given an equation which i have to solve in simulink. the equation is quite veered to me. some one help me in understanding what kind of equation it is so that i can solve it in MATLAB simulink.
(2+x^2)theta'' + (2xx' +1)theta' + 9.8(xcostheta-sinthetha)-x''=T

I think this is your ODE:

##(2+x^2) ⋅ θ'' +(2x⋅x'+1) ⋅ θ' + 9.8 ⋅ (x\, cos(θ)-sin(θ)) - x''= T##

Is T a constant?
Are you given any initial conditions for x, x', θ, or θ' ?
 
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SteamKing said:
I think this is your ODE:

##(2+x^2) ⋅ θ'' +(2x⋅x'+1) ⋅ θ' + 9.8 ⋅ (x\, cos(θ)-sin(θ)) - x''= T##

Is T a constant?
Are you given any initial conditions for x, x', θ, or θ' ?
T=10 and initial condition are zero
 
engnrshyckh said:
T=10 and initial condition are zero

I take it the latter means that x = x' = θ = θ' = 0.
 
SteamKing said:
I take it the latter means that x = x' = θ = θ' = 0.
yes it is written in question that initial condition is zero
 
SteamKing said:
I take it the latter means that x = x' = θ = θ' = 0.
(2+x2)⋅θ′′+(2x⋅x′+1)⋅θ′+9.8⋅(xcos(θ)−sin(θ))−x′′=T this equation is look like to be some kind of pendulum. if we use Laplace transformation what would happen to x'' and x'.as they must be represent some angular velocity component.
 
engnrshyckh said:
(2+x2)⋅θ′′+(2x⋅x′+1)⋅θ′+9.8⋅(xcos(θ)−sin(θ))−x′′=T this equation is look like to be some kind of pendulum. if we use Laplace transformation what would happen to x'' and x'.as they must be represent some angular velocity component.
Since this ODE has mixed terms which are being differentiated and multiplied together, I'm not sure if you could use a LT that you would be able to obtain a closed-form solution.

Right now, the only solution I see is expressing this ODE as a system of first order ODEs and then using a Runge-Kutta numerical technique.

By the way, do x and θ depend on a third parameter, like time?
 
SteamKing said:
Since this ODE has mixed terms which are being differentiated and multiplied together, I'm not sure if you could use a LT that you would be able to obtain a closed-form solution.

Right now, the only solution I see is expressing this ODE as a system of first order ODEs and then using a Runge-Kutta numerical technique.

By the way, do x and θ depend on a third parameter, like time?
 

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here is the snapshot of original problem i have to plot it on simulink. i am confused what to do with x and x' . integrator block of simulink use Runge-Kutta numerical technique.
 
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engnrshyckh said:
here is the snapshot of original problem i have to plot it on simulink. i am confused what to do with x and x' . integrator block of simulink use Runge-Kutta numerical technique.
It's not clear why you are confused.

x and x' have initial conditions just like θ and θ'. You use these initial conditions as a starting point for solving numerically the system of first-order ODEs you obtain after making appropriate substitutions for x" and θ".
 

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