Silly question about (Galilei) transformations

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter haushofer
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Transformations
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the transformation of potential terms under a modified Galilei transformation that includes accelerations. Participants explore the application of the chain rule in this context, particularly focusing on how derivatives transform with respect to the given transformation equations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a transformation involving time and space, questioning how a potential term transforms under this transformation.
  • Another participant clarifies that the transformation discussed is not the standard Galilei group, as it incorporates accelerations.
  • A later reply suggests that the initial confusion could be resolved by calculating the Jacobian and inverting it to find how the derivatives transform.
  • It is noted that the derivative transforms with the inverse of the Jacobian, and the second term in the transformation is zero.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the initial approach to the transformation, but there is agreement on the method of using the Jacobian to resolve the confusion.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the treatment of the second term in the transformation and the implications of the modified Galilei transformation on the potential term.

haushofer
Science Advisor
Insights Author
Messages
3,082
Reaction score
1,602
Hi, I have a silly question concerning the chain rule. Imagine I have a time and space transformation as follows,

[tex] x^0 \rightarrow x^{'0} = x^0 + \xi^0, \ \ \ x^i \rightarrow x^{'i} = R^i_{\ j}(t)x^j + d^i (t) \ \ \ \ \ \ (1)[/tex]
where xi^0 is constant, R is an element of SO(3) and d is a vector with arbitrary time dependence. Now I want to calculate how a potential term transforms under this group:

[tex] \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial x^{'i}} = \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial x^j}\frac{\partial x^j}{\partial x^{'i}} + \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial x^0}\frac{\partial x^0}{\partial x^{'i}}[/tex]

The first term is OK, but I'm confused about the second,

[tex] \frac{\partial \phi}{\partial x^0}\frac{\partial x^0}{\partial x^{'i}} \,.[/tex]

I know that for [itex]x^0 = t[/itex],

[tex] \frac{\partial x^{'i}}{\partial x^0} = \dot{R}^{i}_{\ j}(t)x^j + \dot{d}^i(t)[/tex]

but should I invert this relation, or should I put [itex]\frac{\partial x^0}{\partial x^{'i}}=0[/itex]? So, how does my potential transform under the group given in (1)?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
By the way, this is not the standard Galilei group, but it includes accelerations.
 
It was indeed silly; I just had to calculate the Jacobian

[tex] J = \frac{\partial x^{'\mu}}{\partial x^{\nu}} \ \ \,,[/tex]

and invert it. Then indeed one finds that the derivative transforms with the inverse of A, and the other term is zero:[tex] \partial'_{i} = [A^{-1}]^j{}_i \partial_j \ \ \ \ \ \,.[/tex]
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
950
  • · Replies 53 ·
2
Replies
53
Views
4K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K