Sodium carbonate vs sodium bicarbonate

AI Thread Summary
To identify sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate, several methods can be employed. Dissolving a small amount of each powder in water and measuring the pH is effective; sodium bicarbonate will have a pH below 9, while sodium carbonate will be around 11. Both compounds will react with an acid, producing fizzing, but they will exhibit different titration curves in a laboratory setting. Heating a sample will also help distinguish them, as sodium bicarbonate decomposes and releases carbon dioxide bubbles when heated, while sodium carbonate does not. The discussion also touches on the naming conventions of these compounds, noting that "bicarbonate" refers to the ratio of carbonate to sodium, which is 1:1 for bicarbonate and 1:2 for carbonate. Overall, these methods provide practical ways to differentiate between the two substances.
Rajini
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TL;DR Summary
Identification of sodium carbonate and bicarbonate
Dear all,
How to identify sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate? I have these two powders, and did not label.
Thanks for your reply.
Cheers, Rajini
 
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They even look differently, but it would be hard to describe. Perhaps dissolve a bit in water and measure pH, the difference should be quite substantial - something below 9 for bicarbonate and around 11 for carbonate.
 
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Rajini said:
TL;DR Summary: Identification of sodium carbonate and bicarbonate

Dear all,
How to identify sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate? I have these two powders, and did not label.
Thanks for your reply.
Cheers, Rajini
This takes me back more than fifty years. My ex-wife tried sodium carbonate in a recipe for scones. They tasted of soap!! Daft thing was that we tried three times before realising what was our mistake!!!
I bet the taste test would give the answer without adding in the cooking phase.
I don't believe that my suggestion is, in any way, unsafe and I don't suggest a spoonful size sample = just a finger-tip size.
 
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Thanks! I think I need to buy pH paper. Thanks for your suggestions.
Regards,
Rajini.
 
Rajini said:
TL;DR Summary: Identification of sodium carbonate and bicarbonate

Dear all,
How to identify sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate? I have these two powders, and did not label.
Thanks for your reply.
Cheers, Rajini
Both will fizz if a sample of each is mixed with an acid (using vinegar, maybe). They each will give a different titration curve, so at least if you are in a fitting laboratory situation, you'll find a suggestion of two endpoints for the carbonate, and one endpoint for the bicarbonate. (That is, titrating with an acid titrant.)
 
chemisttree said:
Thats right. A little of both in individual test tubes…. heat gently with bunsen burner. The one that seems to “boil” is the bicarb.
To complete the 'School' experiment, the gas that bubbles off could be collected in an inverted tube ('downward displacement of water') and it will extinguish a burning match etc.
An inverted funnel will collect all the bubbles to where you want them.
 
Just out of curisity, why is it bicarbonate if there is only the one?
 
  • #10
Vanadium 50 said:
Just out of curisity, why is it bicarbonate if there is only the one?
He has both materials.
TL;DR SummaryIdentification of sodium carbonate and bicarbonate
Dear all,
How to identify sodium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate? I have these two powders, and did not label.
Thanks for your reply.
Cheers, Rajini
 
  • #11
I was unclear. Why is it called bicarbonate, especially since there is only one carbonate?
 
  • #12
Vanadium 50 said:
Just out of curiosity, why is it bicarbonate if there is only the one?
The OP's notation is 'old fashioned' and it's what I learned at School. The Bi, ate, ite, ide etc. parts of the name are a code to tell what's what but it's limited and not intuitive. I was told this by a school lab tech not long ago. There is a new system which is more complicated but describes much more complex compounds. This link has many examples of formulae and common names. It doesn't seem to have any logic to me except for very simple compounds. No doubt the PF Chemists will put name right.
 
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  • #13
Bicarbonate because compared to carbonate it appears to have twice the ratio of carbonate to sodium.

Carbonate CO3:Na ratio = 1:2
Bicarbonate CO3:Na ratio = 1:1

Imagine the difficulty of analyzing for that hydrogen in an aqueous solution without modern instruments?
 
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  • #14
Same is true of the sodium salt of bisulfite (HSO3)- and sulfite (SO3)-2.
 
  • #15
chemisttree said:
Same is true of the sodium salt of bisulfite (HSO3)- and sulfite (SO3)-2.
The whole process of early Chemistry was pretty arcane and (just as today) very painstaking.
The mass spectrometer is a very handy modern tool and, as it's a piece of Physics, it takes my fancy, compared with bottles and balances.
 
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