Solve the BEASTly Trapezoids Puzzle: Find the 4 Heights

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving a geometric puzzle involving four isosceles trapezoids inscribed in a circle with a specified radius. Participants explore the relationships between the trapezoids' dimensions, specifically focusing on determining the heights of the trapezoids, while ensuring that all dimensions remain integers.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes a method using the Pythagorean theorem and identities to express the radius squared as a sum of two squares, leading to potential coordinates for the trapezoids.
  • Another participant challenges the initial findings, stating that the equal sides of the trapezoids are not integers based on the proposed heights and dimensions.
  • A formula is introduced by a participant to derive the radius in terms of the trapezoid dimensions, suggesting a different approach to the problem.
  • Further clarification is sought regarding the necessary triangles involved in the calculations, emphasizing the need for specific triangle configurations.
  • A correction is made regarding a factor in the equation used to derive the heights, leading to a new set of potential heights for the trapezoids.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the validity of the initial heights and dimensions proposed. Multiple competing views remain on the correct approach to solving the problem, and the discussion does not reach a consensus on the final heights.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved mathematical steps regarding the derivation of the trapezoid dimensions, and the discussion highlights dependencies on specific triangle configurations and integer constraints.

Wilmer
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A circle radius = 725 contains 4 isosceles
trapezoids, length of shorter parallel sides = 666.

Heights, other parallel sides, and equal sides are all integers.

What are the 4 heights?
 
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Wilmer said:
A circle radius = 725 contains 4 isosceles
trapezoids, length of shorter parallel sides = 666.

Heights, other parallel sides, and equal sides are all integers.

What are the 4 heights?
Best to start with a picture.The radius is 725, and AB = 666, so HB = 333 and by Pythagoras OH = 644. Let OK = $x$ and KC = $y$. Then $x^2+y^2=725^2$. So we need to find several ways to express $725^2$ as the sum of two squares. The way to do that is to use the identity $$(a^2+b^2)(c^2+d^2) = (ac+bd)(ad-bc) = (ac-bd)(ad+bc).$$ Applying that identity repeatedly to the fact that $$725^2 = 5^4\times 29^2 = (2^2+1^2)(2^2+1^2)(2^2+1^2)(2^2+1^2)(5^2+2^2)(5^2+2^2),$$ you find that $$ 725^2 = 725^2+0^2 = 720^2+85^2 = 715^2+120^2 = 696^2+203^2 = 644^2 + 333^2 = 627^2+364^2 = 580^2+435^2 = 525^2+500^2. $$

To find possible coordinates for the point C = $(x,y)$, we must have $y>333$ and $|x|<644$ (to ensure that AB is the shorter of the parallel sides). We also need BC to be an integer, which (from the triangle BLC) means that $(y-333)^2 + (644-x)^2 = \Box$, where $\Box$ means a square. Since $x^2+y^2 = 725^2$, that relation simplifies to $725^2-644x-333y = \Box.$

Checking through the possible values of $(x,y)$, namely $$ (\pm85,720),\ (\pm120,715),\ (\pm203,696),\ (\pm364,627),\ (\pm435,580),\ (\pm500,525),\ (\pm525,500),\ (\pm580,435),\ (\pm627,364), $$ you can verify that there are exactly four values of $x$ that satisfy $725^2-644x-333y = \Box.$ The corresponding heights are the numbers $644-x.$

The values of $x$ are $\pm525,\ \pm627$, and the heights are 17, 119, 1169, 1271.
 

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Nope...with your 4, the 2 equal sides AD and BC are not integers.These are my 4 (height, AD/BC, CD, x):
144, 240, 1050, -500
1144, 1160, 1050, 500
280, 406, 1254, -364
1008, 1050, 1254, 364

Using your diagram:
AB = a, CD = b, height HK = h, OK = x, radius = r
I came up with this formula to derive:
r = SQRT(4x^2 + b^2) / 2 where x = (a^2 - b^2 + 4h^2) / (8h)

I don't know why you listed all the triangles you did;
we need triangle 333-644-725 for all cases;
then we need the triangles with a>333:
364-627-725, 435-580-725 and 500-525-725.
That's it, that's all: right?
 
Last edited:
Wilmer said:
Nope...with your 4, the 2 equal sides AD and BC are not integers.These are my 4 (height, AD/BC, CD, x):
144, 240, 1050, -500
1144, 1160, 1050, 500
280, 406, 1254, -364
1008, 1050, 1254, 364

Using your diagram:
AB = a, CD = b, height HK = h, OK = x, radius = r
I came up with this formula to derive:
r = SQRT(4x^2 + b^2) / 2 where x = (a^2 - b^2 + 4h^2) / (8h)

I don't know why you listed all the triangles you did;
we need triangle 333-644-725 for all cases;
then we need the triangles with a>333:
364-627-725, 435-580-725 and 500-525-725.
That's it, that's all: right?
Yes, you are right. My mistake was that I dropped a factor of 2 in the equation $725^2-644x-333y = \Box.$ It should have read $2(725^2-644x-333y) = \Box.$ I then get the values of $x$ to be $\pm364$ and $\pm500$, giving the heights as 144, 280, 1008, 1144.
 

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