Solving the Partial Derivative Equation: xy*z^2

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving the partial derivative equation given by the expression xy*z^2. Participants are seeking an explicit solution for z as a function of x and y, exploring various methods and approaches to tackle this problem.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses difficulty in finding an explicit solution for z and mentions trying various methods without success.
  • Another participant suggests using separation of variables, proposing a specific form for z and deriving relationships between functions of x and y.
  • A different participant introduces the idea of using a function of the product xy to explore potential solutions, indicating that the solutions may not follow a simple form.
  • One participant claims to have found a general formula for the solutions, emphasizing the broad spectrum of functions that could satisfy the equation.
  • Another participant questions whether certain transformations, such as switching to polar or hyperbolic coordinates, might yield further insights.
  • Several participants discuss the implications of their findings, with one asserting that their method of separation of variables led to a complete integral of the PDE.
  • Another participant highlights the importance of considering arbitrary functions in the solutions and notes that their approach differs in notation from previous contributions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the nature of the solutions or the methods employed. Multiple competing views and approaches are presented, with some participants claiming to have found solutions while others remain skeptical or propose alternative methods.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note the complexity of the equation and the challenges posed by its non-linear nature, suggesting that a simple, universally valid formula may be unattainable. There are also mentions of the need for further exploration of variable transformations and the role of arbitrary functions in the solutions.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying partial differential equations, particularly in the context of non-linear PDEs, as well as individuals looking for various methods of solution and the exploration of mathematical reasoning in this area.

tehno
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[tex]\frac{\partial z}{\partial x}\cdot \frac{\partial z}{\partial y}=xyz^2[/tex]

People,do we know how to solve this?
I'm looking for the explicite solution z=f(x,y) so far I'm unable to solve this .Thinking of it for a half a day without much of the progress.Even though I haven't tryed all dirty tricks yet.
:rolleyes:
 
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Expert help would be appreciated.
 
Well, you might see how separation of variables can help you:
[tex]z=g(x)h(y)\to{g}'gh'h=xy(gh)^{2}\to\frac{g'}{gx}=\frac{yh}{h'}[/tex]

Since LHS is a function of x, whereas RHS is a function of y, we get:
[tex]g'(x)=Kxg(x), h'(y)=\frac{1}{K}yh(y)\to{g}(x)=Ae^{\frac{Kx^{2}}{2}},h(y)=Be^{\frac{y^{2}}{2K}}[/tex]
with A, B, K constants.

Note that it by no means follows from this that all solutions of your PDE must be on this form!

For example, let f(x,y)=G(xy). Then:
[tex]\frac{\partial{f}}{\partial{x}}=yG',\frac{\partial{f}}{\partial{y}}=xG'\to{(G')^{2}}=G^{2}\to{G'}=\pm{G}, z_{+}(x,y)=Ae^{xy},z_{-}(x,y)=Be^{-xy}[/tex]

These radically different special solutions should tell you that to arrive at some simple, generally valid formula for the solutions is impossible. That's usually the case with non-linear PDE's in particular.
 
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Thanks arildno for the inputs.
Neverthless,I have good news:I managed today to find "all" PDE solutions as representation in formal explicite expression z=f(x,y).
Indeed ,as you indicate,that's really broad spectrum of the functions .
:smile:
 
I dis-assume it is a "simple" formula..
 
arildno said:
I dis-assume it is a "simple" formula..
arildno said:
These radically different special solutions should tell you that to arrive at some simple, generally valid formula for the solutions is impossible. That's usually the case with non-linear PDE's in particular.

But I arrived at the generally valid (and explicite!) formula that describes all the solutions of this PDE.
For the first time I effectively find this forum helpful for me,becouse your suggestion of thinking in "exponential terms" was the idea (there's no a classical linear superpositon ,however).
The method of the separation of variables is natural there,but I was blind or something haven't had noticed it before.

The most important was the first step :to write PDE as

[tex]z^{-1}\frac{\partial z}{\partial x}\cdot z^{-1}\frac{\partial z}{\partial y}=xy[/tex]
Other work I will leave as an exercise.
Here's my general formula:

[tex]z=e^{\frac{C^2x^2+y^2}{2C}+ \phi (C)}[/tex]


where [itex]\phi[/itex] is some derivabile arbitrary function such that:

[itex]\phi '(C) +\frac{x^2}{2}-\frac{y^2}{2C^2}=0[/itex]
 
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Oh, really?
As far as I know,
[tex]\frac{1}{z}\frac{\partial{z}}{\partial{x}}=\frac{\partial}{\partial{x}}(\log(|z(x,y)|)+f(y))[/tex]
where f is an arbitrary function of y
Did you take that into account as well?


EDIT:

Personally, I'd have thought some progress might be made to make a switch to polar, or hyperbolic coordinates, but I haven't done so myself..
 
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I collected all the solutions by my formula, neglecting variable interchangable ones,becouse I solved PDE.Try to solve PDE.You will see.
 
Hmm...since I'm not very clever, I won't be able to do so.
Perhaps you can post your solution in a while? :smile:
 
  • #10
All righty.I think ,at least,I owe you that so here is the method.

Write PDE as:
[tex]\frac{\partial z}{z\partial x}\cdot \frac{\partial z}{z\partial y}=xy[/tex]

Let's search for the solutions of this PDE in implicite form.
In order to do that note:

[tex](ln\ z)'=\frac{1}{z}[/tex].

Having on mind this and by introducing substitutions:

[tex]\frac{\partial u}{\partial x}=p,\frac{\partial u}{\partial y}=q[/tex]

our PDE turns into:

[tex]p\cdot q=xy[/tex]

Voila!
The separation of the variables occurs.We have:

[tex]\frac{p}{x}=\frac{y}{q}=C \rightarrow du=Cxdx+\frac{ydy}{C}\rightarrow u=\frac{Cx^2}{2}+\frac{y^2}{2C}+C_{1}[/tex]


Therefore the complete integral of PDE is:

[tex]ln\ z=\frac{Cx^2}{2}+\frac{y^2}{2C} +C_{1}[/tex]


General solution of first order PDE in variables ,knowing one solution H
is obtained per definition from the system:


[tex]H(x,y,z,a,b)=0[/tex]
[tex]\frac{\partial H}{\partial a} + \frac{\partial H}{\partial b}\cdot f'(a)=0[/tex]

So,under assuption that between parameters a and b exists functional relation f(a)=b ,where f is an arbitrary derivabile function the general solution ,after solving the system can be written as:

[tex]ln\ z=\frac{Cx^2}{2}+\frac{y^2}{2C}+2C + f(C)[/tex]

[tex]f'(C) +\frac{x^2}{2}-\frac{y^2}{2C^2}=0[/tex]

Where f is arbitrary function and C real constant.


This solution isn't equivalent in notation with the one given previously.
However, I stressed that I was looking for only solutions given in explicite form z=f(x,y).Hence..
 
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