Subgroup of an arbitrary group

  • Thread starter Thread starter fishturtle1
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Group Subgroup
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on proving that if H is a subgroup of G and H is a subset of K, then H is also a subgroup of K. Participants confirm that H must satisfy all group axioms, including closure under multiplication and inverses, as well as containing the unit element. The conversation highlights the importance of explicitly stating the presence of the unit element, although it is implied by the closure properties. A simpler proof method is suggested, emphasizing the sufficiency of verifying group axioms for subsets.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of group theory concepts, specifically subgroups
  • Familiarity with group axioms: closure, identity, inverses
  • Knowledge of set theory and subset relations
  • Basic proof techniques in mathematics
NEXT STEPS
  • Study the properties of subgroups in abstract algebra
  • Learn about group homomorphisms and their implications for subgroup structures
  • Explore examples of groups and their subgroups, such as cyclic groups
  • Investigate the significance of the identity element in group theory
USEFUL FOR

Mathematics students, particularly those studying abstract algebra, group theory enthusiasts, and educators looking to clarify subgroup properties and proofs.

fishturtle1
Messages
393
Reaction score
82

Homework Statement


Let G be a group. Let H and K be subgroups of G. Prove that if
H ##\subseteq## K, then H is a subgroup of K.

Homework Equations

The Attempt at a Solution


H is a subset of K and H,K are groups.
if x,y, xy ##\epsilon## H, then x,y, xy ##\epsilon## K.
So H is closed under multiplication such that for all x, y, xy ##\epsilon## H,
x, y, xy ##\epsilon## K.

if ##x, x^{-1} \epsilon## H then ##x, x^{-1} \epsilon## K
So H is closed under inverses such that
for all ##x^{-1} \epsilon## H, ##x^{-1} \epsilon## K

H is a subset of K and H is closed under multiplication and closed under inverses so H is also a subgroup of K.

is what I wrote clear?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You forgot "H contains the unit element", but otherwise fine.
I think you can make this argument much simpler though. You already know that H satisfies all group axioms, since it is a subset of G. Since it is also a subset of K it is a subset of K that satisfies all group axioms and therefore a subgroup of K.
 
Orodruin said:
You forgot "H contains the unit element", but otherwise fine.
I think you can make this argument much simpler though. You already know that H satisfies all group axioms, since it is a subset of G. Since it is also a subset of K it is a subset of K that satisfies all group axioms and therefore a subgroup of K.

Thanks for showing me the simpler proof. About the unit element, isn't this implied if H is closed under inverses so is mentioning it just good form? Or is there a case where a set is closed under inverses but does not have the unit element?
 
fishturtle1 said:
Thanks for showing me the simpler proof. About the unit element, isn't this implied if H is closed under inverses so is mentioning it just good form? Or is there a case where a set is closed under inverses but does not have the unit element?
No, you are correct. If the set contains the inverses of all its elements and is closed under the group operation, then the identity must be part of the set. I am just used to ticking off all the group axioms. Also, if you are given a particular subset, it is usually easier to check whether the identity belongs to it than checking if all the inverses do so it might be less work to show that it not a subgroup (if this is the case) just by noting that the identity is not there. Although I have to admit that I omit the associativity property for checking if a group is a subgroup...
 
Orodruin said:
No, you are correct. If the set contains the inverses of all its elements and is closed under the group operation, then the identity must be part of the set. I am just used to ticking off all the group axioms. Also, if you are given a particular subset, it is usually easier to check whether the identity belongs to it than checking if all the inverses do so it might be less work to show that it not a subgroup (if this is the case) just by noting that the identity is not there. Although I have to admit that I omit the associativity property for checking if a group is a subgroup...
Understood, thank you for the help
 
A nice result is that a subset S of G is a subgroup of G if for all x,y in S ## xy^{-1} \in S ##.
 
Question: A clock's minute hand has length 4 and its hour hand has length 3. What is the distance between the tips at the moment when it is increasing most rapidly?(Putnam Exam Question) Answer: Making assumption that both the hands moves at constant angular velocities, the answer is ## \sqrt{7} .## But don't you think this assumption is somewhat doubtful and wrong?

Similar threads

  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K