Surface Area Vector in Exterior Algebra 3D

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the representation of the surface area vector in exterior algebra within a three-dimensional context. Participants explore the relationship between surface area as a vector and its mathematical representation as a 2-form, drawing parallels to volume forms and tensor representations in mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the surface area vector can be represented as a 2-form, suggesting that an n-form defines n-dimensional volume.
  • Another participant acknowledges that while a 2-form is a covariant second-order tensor, the surface area is being treated as a vector, prompting further inquiry.
  • Participants reference the stress distribution formula in mechanics, relating force vectors and stress tensors to area vectors in both conventional and exterior algebra contexts.
  • There is a discussion about the relationship between the oriented parallelogram and the vector derived from it, emphasizing the role of the Hodge-dual in tensor algebra.
  • Several participants propose the expression for the surface area element using the Levi-Civita symbol and wedge products, with some uncertainty regarding normalization factors and index positioning.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of the surface area vector and its representation, with no consensus reached on the correct formulation or interpretation of the concepts discussed.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of missing normalization factors and the necessity of raising indices in certain expressions, which remain unresolved within the discussion.

mikeeey
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Hello every one .
What is the Surface Area vector form in exterior algebra ,I mean by that the Surface Area vector as an exterior form in 3D , just like the volume form .THANKS
 
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Wouldn't that just be a 2-form? A n-form gives a definition of an n-dimensional volume, so an area should be associated with a 2-form.
 
yes its a 2-forms , but 2-form is a co-variant second order tensor , but here the surface area is a vector ,
this is why i want to know ,
in mechanics the stress distribution formula is F^i = \sigma^\ij dA_j
where F is the force vector and (Sigma ) is the mechanical second order stree tensor and A is the Area vector
while in exterior algebra it's written like this F^i = T^i_jk dx^j\wedgedx^k
where T is a third order tensor , when using calculus e.g. co-variant derivative , sigma with give 2 christoffel symbols while the T will give 3 christoffel symbols
 
F^i =\sigma^ij dA_j
F^i= B^i_j_k dx^j \wedge dx^k
 
The "surface area element" can be thought of as a "[3D-]vector" only in 3-D.
In the cross-product, the oriented parallelogram formed from the factors is more fundamental than the vector perpendicular to that parallelogram.
From a tensor algebra viewpoint, to get a vector from the oriented parallelogram,
one has to use the Hodge-dual (often symbolized by *), which involves the \epsilon_{ijk} symbol.
 
you mean dA_i = \epsilon_ijk dx^j \wedge dx^k
 
dA^i = \epsilon _{ijk} dx^j \wedge dx^k
 
mikeeey said:
dA^i = \epsilon _{ijk} dx^j \wedge dx^k

Yes, it's basically this, but you might have some normalization factors in there, I'm not quite sure.

EDIT: Oh, and in your formula the i has moved from lower index to upper index, so you have to raise the index in there somewhere. :)
 

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