System for use in case of emergency in aircraft.

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    Aircraft System
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of automated systems in aircraft, particularly focusing on the potential for machines to take over control in emergencies when pilots are unable to respond. It explores the implications of such systems, including safety concerns and the role of human pilots in the control loop.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants inquire about the existence of automated systems that can take over aircraft control without pilot consent in emergencies.
  • One participant mentions that fly-by-wire systems can override pilot inputs but do not autonomously decide flight paths or land the aircraft.
  • Concerns are raised about the reliability of automated systems, with a participant expressing a preference for human co-pilots and suggesting remote control as an alternative, while also noting potential vulnerabilities such as tampering.
  • Another participant discusses the Boeing 787 Dreamliner's autopilot capabilities, indicating that it can land autonomously but emphasizing that human pilots remain integral to the control process and legal responsibilities.
  • It is noted that most commercial aircraft landings are effectively done autonomously, although human input is still necessary for communication with air traffic control and navigation post-landing.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying opinions on the role of automation in aircraft control, with some supporting the idea of automated systems while others raise concerns about their reliability and safety. There is no consensus on whether machines should take over control without pilot consent.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in current automated systems, including their inability to respond to unexpected situations communicated by air traffic control and the potential for new failure mechanisms introduced by remote control options.

shivakumar06
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l have heard of auto pilot option in flying aircraft. do we have similarly the concept of takeover by the machine with/without the consent of pilot in case pilot cannot answer to safely land the air craft.
 
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Fly by wire systems will directly override the pilot if he does something stupid, but only overriding stick and rudder inputs -- but they won't unilaterally decide where the plane should go or land it.
 
Automatas make many mistakes. I'd dislike the idea that a machine decides that the human is out of order.

Presently we have a co-pilot and this looks more reasonable.

Rather than the machine taking over, I'd prefer a remote control of the plane. With telemetry and cameras, and other pilot - possibly on the ground or in flight - could take over.

Then, it introduces new failure mechanisms and weaknesses, including to tamper. "Not sure" this would improve safety. Think of the drones pirated by Iranians.
 
shivakumar06 said:
l have heard of auto pilot option in flying aircraft. do we have similarly the concept of takeover by the machine with/without the consent of pilot in case pilot cannot answer to safely land the air craft.

Don't know about the "without the consent of the pilot" part, but I've recently been hearing advertisements for the new Boeing 787 Dreamliner aircraft, whose autopilot can land the aircraft autonomously. I didn't find a link to that feature explicitly, but here is the general 787 link:

http://www.boeing.co.uk/Products-Services/Commercial-Airplanes/787/

.
 
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berkeman said:
Don't know about the "without the consent of the pilot" part, but I've recently been hearing advertisements for the new Boeing 787 Dreamliner aircraft, whose autopilot can land the aircraft autonomously.

I'm not sure what specific feature they are advertising there, but almost all commericial aircraft landings are effectively done autonomously already, though there are varying amounts of human input required to get the autopilot communicating iwth the airfield instrument landing system (ILS). The reason is the experimental evidence that on average, autopilots land aircraft more safely than humans.

However the human pilot is still very much in the control loop (and legally responsible for being in control of the aircraft at all times), since autopilots can't respond to Air Traffic Control radio messages like "the plane in front of you has just crashed and blocked the runway you were about to hand on"!

IIRC the 787 does have one new navigational "party trick", which is the ability to automatically steer itself around the airfield after landing to the correct ramp at the terminal. That might sound like a gimmick, but it's not unknown for pilots to "get lost" or take the wrong turning, and backing a big airliner out of a dead-end can soon create a logjam of following traffic, to the point where the airfield can't accept any more landings.
 

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