The Difference Quotient and Integral Calculus

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the difference quotient and its relationship to integral calculus, particularly exploring whether a general formula for the integral exists similar to that of the derivative. Participants examine the nature of integration and its connection to differentiation, including the implications of the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes the absence of a general formula for the integral, contrasting it with the well-known formula for the derivative.
  • Another participant provides a specific formula for the integral, highlighting the limit of a Riemann sum as a potential general expression for integrals, while acknowledging that certain conditions apply.
  • A participant expresses interest in the summation aspect of integration, relating it to the geometric interpretation of integration as summing infinitesimal parts.
  • There is a proposal that composing the integral and derivative functions should yield the original function, suggesting this as a means to demonstrate their inverse relationship.
  • Another participant references the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus, indicating that it supports the idea of differentiation and integration being inverse processes, while noting that there are conditions regarding the continuity of the function involved.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the existence of a general formula for integrals, with some asserting that such a formula does exist while others question its general applicability. The discussion around the inverse relationship between integration and differentiation is acknowledged, but the specifics remain debated.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding the assumptions made about the functions involved, particularly concerning continuity and the specific conditions under which the provided formulas apply. The discussion does not resolve these nuances.

Vodkacannon
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I'm just a high school senior who noticed that the derivative has a general formula that we all know is,
\frac{f(x+h)-f(x)}{h}
but that there is no general formula (at least I haven't heard of it yet) for the integral of a function.
I know I cannot simply just take the inverse of the difference quotient.
Is it impossible to generalize a formula for the integral?
 
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Vodkacannon said:
I'm just a high school senior who noticed that the derivative has a general formula that we all know is,
\frac{f(x+h)-f(x)}{h}
but that there is no general formula (at least I haven't heard of it yet) for the integral of a function.
I know I cannot simply just take the inverse of the difference quotient.
Is it impossible to generalize a formula for the integral?

Sure there is a formula for the integral of a function.

For example, let f:[a,b]\rightarrow \mathbb{R}, then we can write (if the integral exists)

\int_a^b fdx=\lim_{n\rightarrow +\infty} \left[\sum_{k=1}^n f\left(a+k\frac{b-a}{n}\right)\frac{b-a}{n}\right]

This is a possible formula for the integral. Of course, there are some issues, for example, I partitioned [a,b] in a certain way and I let f act on the partition in a certain way. It must be clarified that these choice don't matter (and for which functions they don't matter!). But all in all, this formula can be used for most functions.
 
Interesting. I had never seen that before. I can see why you're using a summation operator because integration is just, in geometric terms, summing up infinitsimaly small parts to make a whole.

Thanks. That was a fast reply.

So I don't start another thread, may I ask if you were to compose the functions of the integral and derivative of a function, f(g(x)) or g(f(x)), you should receive the original function right?
If this is true then this is one way to proove that integration and derivation are inverses.
 
Last edited:
Vodkacannon said:
Interesting. I had never seen that before. I can see why you're using a summation operator because integration is just, in geometric terms, summing up infinitsimaly small parts to make a whole.

Thanks. That was a fast reply.

So I don't start another thread, may I ask if you were to compose the functions of the integral and derivative of a function, f(g(x)) or g(f(x)), you should receive the original function right?
If this is true then this is one way to proove that integration and derivation are inverses.
This is in part what the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus says, that differentiation and integration are essentially inverse processes (not inverse functions - these processes operate on functions). One part of this theorem says
$$ \frac{d}{dx} \int_a^x f(t)~dt = f(x)$$
There's some fine print about the continuity of f and such, but the punch line is as above.
 

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