The nature of virtual photons in quantum electrodynamics

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Discussion Overview

The discussion focuses on the nature of virtual photons in quantum electrodynamics (QED), exploring their role in energy exchange between charged particles and the implications of their classification as "photons." Participants examine the conceptual understanding of virtual photons and their distinction from traditional photons, as well as the potential for confusion surrounding their terminology.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes virtual photons as quanta of energy exchange between charged particles, noting their distinction from traditional photons.
  • Another participant questions the terminology of "photons," suggesting it may lead to confusion and proposing the possibility of virtual photons being an unidentified type of boson.
  • A later reply asserts that virtual photons cannot be considered an unidentified type of boson, indicating a disagreement on this point.
  • One participant expresses frustration over perceived snark in responses, emphasizing the need for civility and support for beginners in the discussion.
  • Another participant clarifies that virtual photons arise specifically from the equations of QFT for the electromagnetic field, contrasting them with virtual particles from other fields like gluons or weak bosons.
  • A participant acknowledges the clarification about virtual photons, expressing gratitude for the explanation and support in understanding quantum mechanics and quantum field theory.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the terminology and classification of virtual photons, with some asserting their specific nature in QED while others propose alternative interpretations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of calling them "photons."

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the nature of virtual particles and their classification may not be fully articulated, and the discussion reflects varying levels of understanding among participants.

Sophrosyne
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TL;DR
Why do we call the virtual photons in quantum electrodynamics photons?
In quantum electrodynamics, the energy exchange between two charged particles is called a virtual photon, allowing the exchange of quanta of energy between the two charged particles. But these are not the traditional photons of electromagnetic waves. They apparently just arise from the equations of QFT, and are called "virtual".

But why call these "photons"? It seems it creates some confusion. Could they even theoretically be an as of yet unidentified type of boson?
 
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Sophrosyne said:
[...] virtual photons [...]
STOP. :warning:

Please read this Insight and this one before proceeding.

Could they even theoretically be an as of yet unidentified type of boson?
No. o0)
 
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This is fine, Thank you for the links- I will study them. But I could do without the funny faces. I am a beginner sincerely trying to learn this stuff, and I don't need the snark. If you can't teach beginners without it don't hang out here.
 
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Sophrosyne said:
could do without the funny faces. I am a beginner sincerely trying to learn this stuff, and I don't need the snark. If you can't teach beginners without it don't hang out here.

Please note, if you think someone else's post violates the forum rules (and we have a rule about being civil with other members), please don't respond in kind in the thread. Use the "Report" button to bring the post to the attention of the moderators.
 
Sophrosyne said:
They apparently just arise from the equations of QFT

They arise from the equations of QFT for the electromagnetic field. That's why they are called virtual photons and not virtual something else. You can have virtual other things (such as virtual gluons or virtual weak bosons), but they will arise from the equations of QFT for other fields, not the electromagnetic field.
 
PeterDonis said:
They arise from the equations of QFT for the electromagnetic field. That's why they are called virtual photons and not virtual something else. You can have virtual other things (such as virtual gluons or virtual weak bosons), but they will arise from the equations of QFT for other fields, not the electromagnetic field.

OK this makes a lot of sense. Thank you very much!
 
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Sophrosyne said:
OK this makes a lot of sense. Thank you very much!

Thank you very much for coming here to seek help in understanding QM and QFT. We really do appreciate people trusting us.

Your question is a common one, and one of our science advisers, also a professor of physics, just so you know its a very reliable source, has written a paper about this and other common 'questions':
https://arxiv.org/abs/quant-ph/0609163

Thanks
Bill
 

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