Thermopower Wave: Nanotube Electron Entrainment

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of a "thermopower wave" generated by exothermic reactions along nanotubes, specifically focusing on the implications for energy conversion efficiency and potential applications in propulsion systems. Participants explore the theoretical underpinnings, practical uses, and comparisons to existing technologies.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the thermopower wave could lead to efficient conversion of chemical energy into electrical energy, though the exact efficiency remains unclear.
  • There is speculation about whether nanotubes, as "quantum wires," provide a special advantage in energy conversion efficiency.
  • One participant questions the potential of using this phenomenon as a bulk electrochemical material for powering ion engines, suggesting it could yield high thrust without nuclear reactors.
  • Another participant raises the idea of optimizing mass ejection in nano-structured chemical fuels to enhance propulsion efficiency through anti-parallel trajectories.
  • Concerns are expressed regarding the theoretical predictions surrounding the thermopower wave, particularly the introduction of a "new phenomenon" affecting carrier propagation, which some find puzzling given existing studies on phonon drag.
  • A participant muses about the potential for using the thermopower wave effect to create power surges in electric motors, drawing parallels to nitrous oxide injectors in combustion engines.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the implications and applications of the thermopower wave, with no consensus reached on its efficiency or practical uses. The discussion remains open with multiple competing ideas and uncertainties present.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved questions regarding the efficiency of energy conversion and the theoretical basis for the thermopower wave, particularly in relation to existing knowledge of phonon drag and its implications for carrier dynamics.

sanman
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Apparently, carrying out an exothermic reaction along the length of a nanotube can result in a "thermopower wave" which results from "electron entrainment" (a wave propagating along the nanotube which pushes electrons along, resulting in a power spike)

http://www.physorg.com/news187186888.htmlSo what can this be used for? What is the efficiency of conversion of the chemical energy into electrical energy?

Is there some special conversion efficiency advantage being achieved here because of nanotubes being an alleged "quantum wire"?

Could you use this as a bulk electrochemical material to power an ion engine and obtain very high thrust without using a nuclear reactor?
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Here's a BBC news article with a video embedded:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8556656.stm

I wonder if there is some way to use nano-structured chemical fuel to optimize the mass ejection, so that as high a mass-fraction as possible would travel on an exactly anti-parallel trajectory, to maximize action-reaction.
 
From previous link:
The rapid transit of the reaction down the nanotubes appeared to pull the electrons within it along. This appears to be something that wasn't predicted by theory, since the authors describe it by writing that they need to "introduce a new phenomenon that results from their effect on carrier propagation." (Of course, if it was completely unexpected, why measure current at all?) They refer to the combined reaction/heat/electrical pulse as a thermopower wave.
Haven't yet read the paper, but I find the bit about introducing a "new phenomenon" somewhat mystifying. After all, phonon drag (and specifically phonon drag thermopower) has been studied in 2DEGs for nearly a couple decades now.
 
I was just musing further on the "thermopower wave" effect.

We have all heard of nitrous oxide injectors being used to boost gasoline combustion engines - this was developed in WW2 for temporarily boosting the speed of aircraft.

Could the thermopower wave effect be used to create a power surge/spike that could strongly boost the speed or accelerative torque of an electric motor in similar fashion?
 

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