Today I Learned

[mfb]

Looks like 325 ml is a common amount of root beer in cans.

Just to get a simple console app with no windows, you need to know QUITE a lot about how to navigate the IDE and if you've never used one before, it's quite daunting.

That's not the impression I got.

 

[phinds]

That's not the impression I got.

Well, perhaps I'm overestimating the difficulty, but I doubt it. I think someone coming to Visual Studio 2017 with no prior experience in IDEs would be VERY daunted indeed, having to wade through HUNDREDS of sometimes confusing drop-down menus to figure out how to do things, having to learn what a object browser is, what the source browser does, what ... ... I could make a really long list but you get the point.

Actually, now that I think about it, *I* was slightly intimidated by VS 2017 since it is quite a bit more complicated than the 2008 version I have been using for many years, and I've been using Microsoft IDE's since there has BEEN such a thing, decades ago. I'm really sure that a newcomer would be more than a little intimidated.

 

[mfb]

If you just want to run 10 lines of C++ (or whatever) to get started, you don't need all those things. You open a new project and mainly take the default settings, add a file, write a code and then run it.

 

[phinds]

If you just want to run 10 lines of C++ (or whatever) to get started, you don't need all those things. You open a new project and mainly take the default settings, add a file, write a code and then run it.

Well, Jim (@jim hardy) how about you download it and let us know what you think. It's free and it's easy to install, it's just (*I* think) not so easy to use until you climb the learning curve, but maybe mfb is right).

 

[Aufbauwerk 2045]

hmmmm for an old guy who loved Qbasic and whose assembler days were forty years ago (not Intel)

is there any hope of learning the rudiments of that Studio language ?

I suppose so, but there are alternatives.

First of all, if you are interested it might be a good idea to find a Visual Basic tutorial on Youtube. Something that introduces Visual Basic programming using Microsoft Visual Studio Express or perhaps the new version which is Visual Studio Community.

But if you would still like to use Basic (even Qbasic) without going right into Visual Studio, you can try one of the newer free Basic compilers. One popular example is FreeBasic. There are other free and commercial versions available. I believe FreeBasic still has a Qbasic compatibility mode. You don't need to learn a fancy IDE (Integrated Development Environment) like Visual Studio in order to use it. I think this could be a fairly easy way to get back into Basic programming.

https://www.freebasic.net

Or you can take the big leap to Windows programming using either Visual Studio Express or Visual Studio Community (the latter being newer). These are IDEs which make Windows programming "easy" (once you pass the learning curve for the IDE itself, of course.) If you download the complete system it seems you get a whole bunch of languages, not just the one you want. But Visual Basic is included.

https://www.visualstudio.com/vs/visual-studio-express/

I think Basic is a perfectly good language for many applications, even though it was invented for "beginners." But it's developed a lot since then.

Here is an example of a game developed using QBasic.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2033318/black-annex-is-the-best-qbasic-game-youve-ever-seen.html

There is a good book on programming using Qbasic. It's called The Revolutionary Guide To Qbasic.

There is even a Basic version of one of the popular books on numerical algorithms: Numerical Recipes in Basic by Sprott.

Anyway I would say go for it. I plan to be programming day and night when I'm 100. Then, maybe, I will think about going on a short vacation.

:)

 

[jim hardy]

Well, Jim (@jim hardy) how about you download it and let us know what you think.

It installed okay i think, at least reports that it did. The terms are all unfamiliar. Will put a toe in the water next few days... got to go get tires this morning.

Thanks Auf-2045 for those tips on Basic ! Visual Basic might be a steppingstone ?

old jim

 

[mfb]

VisualBasic is a weird programming language in some aspects.
Never used Basic.

 

[Aufbauwerk 2045]

Ain't that the truth. I've had Macbooks for 10 years now, and still haven't figured out the Xcode "environment".
But that doesn't stop me. Every year, I create a new "project".
My latest project's name: "nevergiveup".
It would appear that on my last attempt , I learned how to put in a "text box".

View attachment 127433

It will probably take me another 5 years to figure out how I did that.

You are right to point out the absurdity of overly complex IDE's which make our life "simpler."

It's truly amazing how software has become a nightmare of complex garbage, when actually it could all be so simple if people did it the right way. According to Wirth this has something to do with technical vs. commercial motives. Follow the money. Then read Wirth's essay A Plea For Lean Software.

 

[nsaspook]

Today I learned about: http://www.theuselessweb.com/

http://www.sanger.dk/

 

[phinds]

You are right to point out the absurdity of overly complex IDE's which make our life "simpler."

It's truly amazing how software has become a nightmare of complex garbage, when actually it could all be so simple if people did it the right way. According to Wirth this has something to do with technical vs. commercial motives. Follow the money. Then read Wirth's essay A Plea For Lean Software.

I disagree completely. The current VS 2017 is REALLY complex but I'd be surprised if there was stuff there that no one got any use from. It WOULD be nice if there were a simpler version for newcomers but I would NOT want any of the complexity removed. And that's just the "community" version. The Pro and Enterprise versions have even more complexity and I'm sure the people who use them would not want any of it to disappear. You are looking for reduced feature versions and many of us (probably most) would not want that.

 

[phinds]

It installed okay i think, at least reports that it did. The terms are all unfamiliar. Will put a toe in the water next few days... got to go get tires this morning.

Thanks Auf-2045 for those tips on Basic ! Visual Basic might be a steppingstone ?

Stepping stone to WHAT? I've been using VB since there WAS a VB. It was a bit primitive 25 years ago but now its very powerful and has been more than adequate since VB 6 at which point I dropped all my C/C++ programming and went purely w/ VB. You cannot do anything in any dev language for MS products that you can't do with VB.NET After all, they all run off of the "dot net" Framework and VB.NET accesses it just as well as anything.

 

[OmCheeto]

Today I learned about: http://www.theuselessweb.com/
...

Actually, the second useless link that theuselessweb.com took me to seemed quite useful, for PF.

http://eelslap.com/

Just don't show @Evo .

 

[Aufbauwerk 2045]

Today I learned something about Oleg Losev, the discoverer of the LED.

There's an old PF post which links to this BBC News article. Apparently the BBC writer did not know about Losev.

"The LED started life in October 1962, as a single red illumination in a General Electric research lab in New York state."

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-19886534

Losev was denied higher education because he was an aristocrat, he never obtained the job he deserved, and he was destroyed by war. Yet, when all is said and done, he will be remembered as the pioneer of the LED.

http://www.circuitstoday.com/invention-history-of-light-emitting-diode-led

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleg_Losev

 

[Aufbauwerk 2045]

Stepping stone to WHAT? I've been using VB since there WAS a VB. It was a bit primitive 25 years ago but now its very powerful and has been more than adequate since VB 6 at which point I dropped all my C/C++ programming and went purely w/ VB. You cannot do anything in any dev language for MS products that you can't do with VB.NET After all, they all run off of the "dot net" Framework and VB.NET accesses it just as well as anything.

I think VB is very useful for people who want to do many kinds of Windows programming. I've used it myself. For example, if I was doing some database programming for Windows, and I wanted a nice GUI, my first thought would be VB. Although I believe some people would say use C#. For games using real-time 3D graphics, VB would not be most people's first choice. I don't think there is any "best" language.

If someone wants to brush up on Basic, without getting into Windows programing right away, then something like FreeBasic could be better.

I think MS was trying to develop a sort of upgraded Qbasic interpreter or perhaps a very trimmed down VB, but I don't have any recent information on that.

 

[OmCheeto]

You are right to point out the absurdity of overly complex IDE's which make our life "simpler."

It's truly amazing how software has become a nightmare of complex garbage, when actually it could all be so simple if people did it the right way. According to Wirth this has something to do with technical vs. commercial motives. Follow the money. Then read Wirth's essay A Plea For Lean Software.

As far as being overly complex, I'm not sure. All I really need now, as before, is a step in the door. Way back in 2000 I purchased Borland's Builder, version 2 generations ago, for nearly nothing, and the instruction manuals were obviously not written for me, so I bought "Builder for Dummies". Once that book got me in the door, there was no stopping me.

The 30 page piece of software I wrote for my 1st term CS class, which was a step above everyone else's "Hello World", later turned into a tool I introduced at work, and wouldn't become obsolete for 20 years. (Company memo: "No matter how sweet your algorithm was, we will no longer be supporting software written for Win 3.14, you sorry old hippy coders"... ) I think it saved the company about a million dollars in wages. But did I ever see any of that? Nooooooooo...

ps. I'm not about to read a book on how stupid the computer industry is, when I should be getting back into coding. Coding is freakin' the bomb!

 

[jim hardy]

Stepping stone to WHAT?

From Basic to that IDE world.

 

[mfb]

Actually, the second useless link that theuselessweb.com took me to seemed quite useful, for PF.

http://eelslap.com/

Just don't show @Evo .

They have ~70 websites in the list.

http://www.koalastothemax.com/
Something happens if you finish it.

http://pixelsfighting.com/

 

[phinds]

From Basic to that IDE world.

Oh, I see. You're talking about going from the old BASIC to VB. Good point.

 

[DennisN]

Today I learned about: http://www.theuselessweb.com/

A link I got, to infinity and beyond :
http://endless.horse/

 

[Jonathan Scott]

A link I got, to infinity and beyond :

How about infinite broccoli: http://i.imgur.com/p9wxQVr.gif
(I tried to imbed the gif image but it didn't work)

 

[Aufbauwerk 2045]

Today I learned that I like to post music videos as a way of avoiding any mention of serious matters. I think I will curtail my music video posting for now.

Speaking of serious matters, I learned that, according to one website, there are many job openings in Integrated Missile Defense, and they pay very well. The lowest salary group starts at $65,000. Most of these jobs are full-time. Not bad in today's gig economy. Maybe this kind of information will help those who are in the stage of life when they are wondering what to study and what kind of jobs to aim for.

http://www.indeed.com/q-Integrated-Air-Missile-Defense-jobs.html

 

[rootone]

I learned that while lithium based batteries are still regarded as potentially hazardous,
there are upcoming new designs which eliminate the hazards, and may prove to be the essential missing component
in power supply grid systems that mostly produce energy from renewable but uncertain sources, solar, wind, tidal etc.

 

[EnumaElish]

TIL a couple of physicists have been researching conspiracy theories. One of them is named Antonin Scalia. (Source: Sci. Am. April 2017 p. 60)

Spoiler

"The leading conspiracy theory about Antonin Scalia’s death: Obama did it.The Supreme Court justice died in his sleep on Saturday at a luxury resort in West Texas, putting the Court’s conservative majority at risk. If President Obama’s eventual nominee somehow gets confirmed this year, which is no sure thing, the court will have five Democrat-appointed justices to the four picked by Republican presidents. So of course some paranoid people on Twitter smell foul play." https://newrepublic.com/minutes/129888/leading-conspiracy-theory-antonin-scalias-death-obama-it

 

[dlgoff]

TIL that @berkeman may be an old hippie.
https://www.physicsforums.com/threa...s-their-function-purpose.906936/#post-5712008

 

[Simon Peach]

Oh! dear, just found this thread. This could be the down fall of my marriage, as she tells me that I already spend 'to much time looking at useless stuff.' Well today I learned about 'oyster veneering' and that's the second posting in this thread! wonder if I'll ever get to the last post?

 

[zoobyshoe]

Today I learned of the existence of the TV channel, C-Span3, American History TV.

After a mere minute I found myself sucked into an excellent lecture on Abraham Lincoln, and had to watch the whole thing, which I think ended up being about 90 minutes. The historian was a guy named Allen Guelzo, a top notch lecturer.

 

[jim hardy]

Got BYUTV on your provider?

Check out "American Ride" a surprisingly interesting series with a "biker" motif.

 

[Simon Peach]

today I learned that they may be negative mass

 

[fresh_42]

today I learned that they may be negative mass

Something you better forget again immediately.

 

[Dr Transport]

I wish I could find negative mass... and add a little to myself...