Uncovering the Secrets of How WWI Planes Took Flight

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the aerodynamics of World War I airplanes, specifically focusing on the design of their wings and how they achieved flight. Participants explore the characteristics of wing shapes, the role of airfoils, and the principles of lift generation in the context of early aviation technology.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether the multi-layered wings of WWI planes serve the same aerodynamic purpose as modern airfoils, suggesting that the geometry of these wings may still create a pressure difference.
  • Others note that while some WWI planes had multiple wings, the majority were biplanes with two wings, and the design was influenced by the materials available at the time.
  • There is a discussion about the effectiveness of flat plates in generating lift at a positive angle of attack, with some participants asserting that even flat wings can achieve flight under certain conditions.
  • Participants reference Bernoulli's principle as a key factor in how wings generate lift, while others challenge this understanding, suggesting that the mechanics of lift involve pushing air downwards.
  • Some contributions highlight the structural considerations of wing design, including the impact of stacking wings on lift and drag, and the limitations of materials used in WWI aircraft.
  • There are differing views on the functionality of ailerons, with some asserting that they can influence both roll and elevation, while others clarify that their primary role is to control roll.
  • A participant mentions the Wright brothers' wind tunnel tests and their influence on wing design, suggesting that the thin wing sections were a result of testing outcomes and material constraints.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the aerodynamics of WWI planes, with no clear consensus on the effectiveness of various wing designs or the mechanics of lift generation. Disagreements arise particularly around the role of ailerons and the interpretation of aerodynamic principles.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions reference specific aerodynamic principles and historical design choices without fully resolving the implications of those choices on flight performance. The conversation also touches on the limitations of materials and structural integrity in early aircraft design.

  • #61
cragar said:
A plane works because of Bernoulli's principle the air flows faster on top
because of the shape of the wing thus creating a low pressure on top
and the high pressure on the bottom of the wing pushes the plane up , I mean yes it can climb by moving the aileron's .

OK, if it's wing shape resulting in less pressure on top than on the bottom, then how do they fly upside down? Ailerons do not control up and down movement. Elevators do that.
 
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  • #62
I was looking for information about biplanes when I can upon this forum.

There are a few reasons biplanes were popular during WWI. As we all know from the drag equation, drag increases with speed. At 100mph, drag is much lower than at 1200mph let alone 200mph, which was the speed being achieved when monoplanes became popular in combat. Lower drag forces resulting from lower speeds meant that it was not unpractical to add the additional drag of a second wing in exchange for the lift and agility it provides. Triplanes fell from favor because they restricted vision. As mentioned before, multiple wings are made into a truss. If you've ever seen any of these aircraft, you will be astonished that they are more like furniture than any vehicle you are familiar with. Monoplanes were better suited to endurance flights as they lacked the structure to withstand radical maneuvers and stunt flying.

Pressure differentials do play a part in lift. A wing is a baffle. Think of how water skis work; that is how a wing works. The air under the wing is exerting a pressure directly to the wing. If there is no angle of attack, there is normally not enough lift to generate flight. Ailerons, elevators, stabilators, elevons, flaps, and air brakes all work off of the same principle. They redirect the flow of air. Flaps generate more drag because they redirect air more radically, but they direct air downwards. This allows for slower speeds to generate sufficient lift. The force vector is more vertical. Stabilizers are horizontal in order to counter the moment that the wing imparts on the aircraft. If the stabilizer has the same angle of attack that the wing has, the aircraft would never leave the runway.

Airplanes fly upside down by "diving" up while inverted. The elevating mechanism is directing air upwards, driving the tail section down. This counters the downward velocity the aircraft would otherwise have. If an aircraft is inverted and no other control is exerted, the aircraft loses altitude.
 
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