Understanding Electron Orbitals: The Role of Photons in Orbital Changes

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of electron orbitals and the role of photons in the transitions between these orbitals. Participants explore the relationship between energy levels, photon emission, and absorption in the context of atomic structure, with references to analogies and intuitive understandings of these processes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents an analogy comparing electrons to handballs and the nucleus to the Earth, suggesting that energy input raises the electron's potential energy, leading to photon emission when the electron "falls" back.
  • Another participant questions the terminology used regarding "increasing its orbital," seeking clarification on the concept of energy levels in different atoms.
  • A clarification is provided that energy conservation dictates a photon is emitted only when an electron transitions from a higher energy level to a lower one, and that energy must be absorbed from an incoming photon for an electron to move to a higher energy level.
  • A participant expresses understanding of the energy absorption process and connects it to the phenomenon of hot objects glowing, questioning whether the energy from heat causes electrons to shift between orbitals and produce photons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the principle of energy conservation in electron transitions, but there is some confusion regarding the terminology and the implications of these transitions, particularly in relation to analogies and intuitive models.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the nature of energy levels and photon interactions may not be fully articulated, and the discussion reflects varying levels of familiarity with the underlying physics concepts.

nhmllr
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I've haven't taken a chemistry course as of yet, so I'm probably getting something very wrong here, but one thing that someone said confused me.

They said that when an electron changes it's orbital, it emits a photon.

I like to think about orbitals (and I know that this is ONLY a useful analogy) where electrons are handballs, the nucleus is the earth, and the handball want to fall as close to the Earth as possible. If you pump energy (in the form of photons) into the atom, you raise the handball/electron further from the Earth (increasing its potential energy). Then, the electron will fall back down to the nucleus, and this energy, instead of manifesting itself in kinetic energy, manifests itself in a photon which is released from the atom.

But why would an atom release a photon when the electron INCREASES its orbital? Am I misinterpreting what they said, or is this where my helpful analogy breaks down?
 
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What do you mean, increases its orbital?
 
Pengwuino said:
What do you mean, increases its orbital?

Sorry- I mean that if in hydrogen, the electron is the the first orbital, and in Lithium (number 3) two electrons are in the first orbital and one is in the second. As the orbitals progress, the electrons in said orbitals get further and further away from the nucleus.

Like, if you want to think about the Sun and planets, Mercury is an electron in the first orbital, and Venus is the second, Earth the third, and so on. Is that clear?
 
Last edited:
Energy has to be conserved. A photon is only emitted if an electron moves from a higher energy level to a lower one. The energy of the emitted photon is equal to the difference between the two energy levels.

If an electron is to move from a lower energy level to a higher one, it must gain an amount of energy equal to the difference between the two levels. This energy has to come from somewhere. So this process can't happen spontaneously. But it can happen if an *incoming* photon of the right energy is absorbed by the electron, exciting it to the higher energy level.
 
cepheid said:
Energy has to be conserved. A photon is only emitted if an electron moves from a higher energy level to a lower one. The energy of the emitted photon is equal to the difference between the two energy levels.

If an electron is to move from a lower energy level to a higher one, it must gain an amount of energy equal to the difference between the two levels. This energy has to come from somewhere. So this process can't happen spontaneously. But it can happen if an *incoming* photon of the right energy is absorbed by the electron, exciting it to the higher energy level.

Oh, ok, so my intuition was right. :)
One questions- does this have to do with why hot things glow? Is energy in the form of photons the same as kinetic energy of the atom caused by heat, shifting electrons fro higher to lower orbits and in the process producing photons? (Both infrared and visible)
 

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